Evening all, encouragement and guidance needed!

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Hi

I’ve been learning guitar for over a year now. Late starter in my 40s after trying once before a couple of decades ago but I’m not sure I’m not a little lost again.

I actually worked through the first 5 modules fairly easily. I have A, D, E, G, Am, Em down but have stopped myself moving on as i don’t know if my approach is structured enough because I can’t actually play a song that’s recognisable.

I can play a Horse With No Name and strum along to simple songs on the app Like Born in the USA and Dance The Night Away but they are very simple A and D chords just strummed in the background.

I can also play simple one and two string riffs ok and I think I’m fine at the come as you are riff for example but I’m just noodling or practicing stuff again again that I’m already ok with. I’m lost for a song that I can play with what I know but also sounds recognisable on its own. A lot of the songs suggested are just simple strums behind the app backing tracks.

I feel a cheat moving on and learning more chords and stuff as I think I have enough already that my repertoire should be more.and I want to know I can actually play a tune and not just four strums of D followed by four strums of A etc.

I’ve plumped once and for all to just learn one and gone with Working Class Hero as it’s fairly easy chords but struggling with correct folk G shape and landing my little finger. Just gonna get through it with the G shape I can currently play it with to try and break this block I’ve put myself into.

I’m worried if I can’t get it down though I may start dropping guitar. Feel I should be more capable at actually playing something after over a year.

Anyone any ideas for suitable simple tunes that I can play solo that sound like something?

Thanks in advance

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Learning guitar or any instrument is not an easy thing, it is also time dependant, meaning the more time you spend on it the quicker you improve, if you do not have much time to practice then it may be challenging. It sounds like you have done 5 modules of grade 1, I would suggest several things you try and set aside 30-60 minutes a day for guitar practice, move forward in the modules so you start to learn more and move forward, take a look at the web site lessons for grade 1 etc and use the practice assistant to record progress.

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Thanks for the reply.

I do practice, and have time to, usually more than an hour a day, that’s not the problem.

As I said I don’t want to move forward more yet, that isn’t the problem. I feel that although I’ve learnt the modules something is obviously missing as I’m not really playing any of the songs that are suggested for grade 1. They don’t really seem to be songs as such, more just strumming along in background to band performances on the app.

I’m obviously looking at it wrong but I guess I’m looking for a simple tune I can play solo that someone would recognise, without aid of backing track to do so. Just to validate the stuff I currently know. Like right it’s been a year, you know this and you can do this. That bit of it seems to be missing for me.

I could go on and learn all sorts from Sus chords to bends etc etc but seems a bit pointless if I can’t knock out a recognisable bah bah black sheep unfortunately.

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I didnt play any songs untill I got to the end of Grade 2. I sort of Played 3 little birds and a zombie, and a love song for my wife. but then I just decided to do concentrate all my time doing foundation stuff. I did that untill end of 2 with a few lessons of 3. Once I was there I had a huge pool of music to pick from and I was able to spend a solid 2 months just learning songs. I was able to learn my 10-12 full song real easy. This was a bit easier for me.

Personally i think its ok to keep moving if you feel like you are getting stalled especially if you are not seeing progress you want in lew of the practice you are doing. You probobly just have not gotten to the lessons you need to learn the things you require to to play the things you want to play yet. Go ahead and move on if that works for you. You will know where you skills and motor movment is not there. Add those things to the practice, go back hit the vids again. Everyone is different. Whats the old saying? “There are many ways to cook a cake” Well thats not the real one but anyway you got me.

I use the Practice assisstant dilligently daily as justin suggests. After I would do my extras. Before stopping just move on. You will end up getting that folk G and you wont even realize it happened. Then you will say oh let me look at some song that use it. Dont give up, once you get to the end of grade 2 you will find a lot of things open up. Then grade 3 you start learning a lot of fun stuff. :grin:

Good luck to you. You can do it, try not to get discouraged.

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Nugget, this is a common challenge. Do you sing and play? I think part of the challenge in the early days, is that without melody strumming a chord progression can be almost any song that has that chord progression. Eventually, and I am far from that, picking notes, adding dynamics, leads to a solo guitar sounding more like the original. But for me, as a simple cap-fire cowboy-chord strummer, it is my attempt to sing which adds melody that makes it recognisable.

I think you could continue to move on. Be guided by Justin’s suggestions on making progress and enjoy the learning. It sounds like you are making good progress and forget about how long it may be taking.

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Nugget,

I had all these same questions during and after completing grade 1. I was frustrated that a few sequences of basic chords wasn’t a song. So I thought a lot about it before moving on.

The first thing I realised is that many popular songs have a basis of just a few chords. It’s that simple. At the same time I also saw a video of Ed Sheeran where he was explaining that he could play at least 100 different songs just by strumming the same 3 simple chords and then he gave some examples. What made them into songs was his singing plus the rhythm.

So I started singing and playing but it’s been a very long hard road as it’s not easy for me and in a way it has slowed down my guitar learning. But at least the songs are then recognisable.

Then the other thing I worked on is rhythm and in songs that are easily recognised because of the rhythm. 2 good examples are Free fallin by Tom Petty snd One by U2. Actually if you can play the chord sequences for those songs and the correct rhythm everyone recognises them without the lyrics. They are easy songs.

I put in a lot of effort into strumming and being able to switch in a song between strumming patterns. That was actually a didficult but fun process and I’ve realised that this ability is something that is really useful in making the song sound like a song rather than just 4 strums of a chord. I followed Justin’s strumming course for this and it really paid off. I love strumming and changing the patterns and rhythm.

Then the other thing you can work on for songs is dynamics. It gives so much more feeling to a song when you alter the quiet and loud sections of the song.

So there is a lot you can do. Don’t give up now. The rest of Grade 1 and all of grade 2 is a lot of fun and there are loads of exciting things to learn. I felt just like you at that stage in the course and I only realky started playing songs that I think actually sound like songs in consolidation at the end of grade 2.

Keep at it! Best Ian

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Hi Nugget, I have had the same feeling as you and I am sure others have as well. Just playing rhythm guitar can sound and feel a bit dull, especially if you are playing very simple strum patterns, eg D D D D or even good old faithful D Du u D.

As others have said what is missing is the melody, so some beginners start to sing along, something I found very hard to do. There definitely are songs which have very identifiable rhythm parts from the way they are played but most require a higher level of proficiency. For example ‘A Design For Life’ by the Manic Street Preachers, it uses a variety of chords that are played as arpeggios(strings plucked individually) in 12/8 time and there are very identifiable riffs at specific parts of the chorus, the way it is played, the chords and riffs make it very distinctive. Pink Floyd’s ‘Wish You Were Here’ is another such song. Justin introduces it in Grade 2 Module 8 in a simpler to learn form, but it is not an easy song to play, so it stretches most and if you add complexity to get closer to the original then it is a challenge for most, including me. Justin calls it a grower, this may be the sort of thing you are looking for and will re-kindle your love for playing guitar.

In later modules and grades more complexity, techniques, chords and riffs are introduced, and this will lead you into trying different material. If you are happy with what you can do at present, chord changes, rhythm accuracy then definitely move on with the modules, it sounds you need to.

Personally I find using the JG website better for learning, and initially I supplemented it with the App to practice songs and rhythm. My honest advice is complete Grade 1 and go through grade 2 at a reasonable pace, I would have thought if you are doing an hour a day you should be able to do so reasonably competently in 3 months, if you get stuck on an aspect or technique ask for help as you have done.

I hope this helps and you keep playing. :sign_of_the_horns::guitar:

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Hi Nugget,

Welcome here and I wish you a lot of fun :smiling_face_with_sunglasses:

This nice path you have found is just like a ball rolling up the mountain… :upside_down_face: you think ‘how is that possible?’ it seems impossible but everything will become clear if you continue calmly and keep pick up that guitar … and if you get stuck or want to share fun things, there is a great community here… :grinning_face_with_big_eyes:

Greetings,Rogier

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Dead Flowers by the Rolling Stones.

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It’s short, G-A-D and the “Old Faithful” strumming pattern will get the job done.

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@mfeeney0110 That’s a nice little suggestion and some great advice, keep playing mate, try taking theory up as well, just something related and gives you a break

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Hello @Nugglechops

Your frustrations are common. Everyone hits plateaux in their learning and playing. Here is one for you.
When yo usay that your playing doesn’t sound like the song there are some wider perspectives to add context to manage your expectations.

Songs, recorded songs you buy or hear on the radio or streaming are produced and contain many, many tracks of instruments, each carefully recorded and balanced , likely with at least some sort of effects and processing, then mixed for an optimal sound.
It is impossible to replicate that on a single guitar.

A good song, in my view, absolutely can be performed and sound great if played on a single guitar with a good singer delivering the vocal. MTV Unplugged was a very popular format … though seldom with single performers, usually with bands.

If you want to draw some inspiration for how good songs can sound amazing, search on youtube (say) for acoustic solo performances of some songs you like. Those can give you inspiration for your longer term goals perhaps. But as a beginner, you will not have all the rhythm skills and techniques, the fluency with riffs and additional embellishment parts that those performances may contain.

For sure, you do want to be playing something more complex and interesting than four down strums per bar. You should already have spent good time developing some skill with that. In Module 3 Justin introduces Up strums and several useful rhythm patterns mixing Down and Up strums. In Module 4 he teaches Old Faithful, a strumming pattern heard on millions of songs and covers. In Module 5 are two further lessons on strumming here and here.

That is where you say you have restricted yourself in terms of progression through the Beginner course.
Even within those modules are many skills that can make your playing and playing along with songs and the App much more interesting and enjoyable. Far more than simply playing four Down strums. Plus there are many, many songs you can select to play.

BUT

I really do encourage you to move along and continue your learning and development too. You will learn, in the remainder of Grade 1, not just extra chords but additional skills and techniques and approaches to playing that will enhance all that you can already do and all that you will go on to learn in the future.

I understand that you’re frustrated. It happens. But the way through is to gain something fresh … new songs, new chords, new rhythm, new skills. There are two additional Modules in Grade 1. Make your new year resolution - or your festive vacation - one based on learning and progressing through those. Then spend some dedicated time consolidating so you’re a solid Grade Oner!

:slight_smile:

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Eventually also, the app will offer you more challenging strumming patterns to make it more fun. And there is nothing stopping you from trying the strumming patterns that Richard suggested in the app :smiling_face: There is a lot of fun to have with those band backing tracks :smiling_face:

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This was something that seriously frustrated me early in my own guitar learning. I’m also in my 40’s and tried to learn for the first time decades ago. Quarter note strums for an entire song gets frustrating fast and the private instructors that were teaching me had me doing ONLY that for so long that I hit the frustration hard.

So now that you have a few chords down, definitely put some time into learning different strumming patterns as @Richard_close2u recommends. I definitely get wanting to move away from a backing track to sound like you’re really playing, but at a basic level, I find playing that way with nothing extra to be boring. There are really only a couple of songs I can sing and play at the same time, and my singing isn’t really good enough for me to take it outside of my bedroom. So I really need something extra to help me feel like I’m sounding good. I lean on backing tracks, playing along with the original recording, and the Boss drum machine I bought awhile back.

I also sometimes attend song circle jams where most folks are just strumming. Folks of different ability levels show up and it starts to sound really good when you get people strumming different things (and maybe a fingerpicker or two) all in time plus at least one person who can sing (IME, that’s the rarest thing of all). There’s one song circle I go to sometimes (less commonly lately and that bugs me) that’s mostly ukuleles but people with a number of other instruments show up sometimes, too. guitar, banjo, mandolin, snare drum, uke bass. Plus a few people who like to sing (whether they’re good or not is a different question, but at least they enjoy it and can multitask that way, which I cannot do well). That starts to sound like a real band and it’s fun. And in that kind of environment, playing quarter note strums when the ukes are flying along too fast for me to keep up actually sounds good.

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You’ve already gotten a lot of good advice, but I would only add that it might be helpful to separate out all of these skills that you’re talking about so that they’re less overwhelming. “Playing guitar” includes a lot of really different skills, and none of us focuses on all of them equally (or at all). Strumming chords to support a band or a singer, for example, is a different skill from performing a song on a single guitar with your own vocal alone. If your goal is to be able to do the latter, you’ll have a different practice routine from someone who is learning the guitar tracks to a particular song, as recorded on the album. It sounds like you’re making a lot of progress, but you’ve chosen an end goal that is more complex than you realize and so you aren’t able to enjoy the progress are making.

Can you wrangle a friend who can sing over top of the chords you’re learning to strum so that it more clearly is a specific song? (Singing yourself, and also singing and strumming at the same time are two additional skills, after all, on top of strumming chords).

Sometimes just reframing your goals in your own head and breaking them down into more bite-sized chunks will make you feel like you’re progressing in a way that just thinking about one big end goal won’t.

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As others have said, if you don’t know the old faithful pattern then definitely learn that as it’s definitely more musical than straight down strumming.

From my experience I think at first aiming to be a competent rhythm guitarist isn’t a bad place to start. This does likely mean that if you just strum along with no backing track or vocals then it is just a series of chords but learning to play lead guitar takes time. My approach was to find some online lessons for songs I wanted to learn and l learned to strum along to the original recordings. Once you can strum along then perhaps the next step is to add a signature riff or something like that which makes it a bit more identifiable.

I’d definitely move on though as I think it’s important to get the C and Em chords under your belt as they open up many more songs

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Welcome to the community forum. I’ve noticed that no one has mentioned the song lessons on the JG website. You can filter the list of songs to show just grade 1 songs or even just the chords that you know. Those song lessons are one of the things that have kept me on Justin’s site. Listen to Justin performing the intro to some of the songs that you know or would like to learn to play and find songs that sound like how you think they should sound. Justin starts the lesson with simple chord progressions and down strums and then shows how to play the song so that it sounds more like the recorded song. I would say that half of all that I have learned from Justin’s website has come from looking and playing along to (almost :slight_smile: ) all the beginning songs lessons.]

I will add that some of of the grade 1 intros will have Justin using strumming patterns, chords and techniques that are beyond grade 1, but it may give you motivation to learn grade 2 lessons.

I find that songs that have a mixture of major and minor chords are more interesting to play. The one exception I can think of is the Hendrix cover of Hey Joe - just play C G D A E E over and over with two strums per chord ( four strums per E chord) and it sounds like the song. You didn’t mention the C chord above in the list of chords you had mastered, so I assumed that was just a typo.

If you practice an hour a day and 6 days a week, you should be able to complete a module in 2 to 4 weeks if you are following Justin’s practice routines. So you could have completed modules 1 to 7 in seven months and spent the rest of the year using what you know playing songs. Maybe you are bored because you need to move on to grade 2. You’ll be practicing the basic open chords in grade 2 as well as learning new things. The most important thing is to have fun playing the guitar.

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I understand your point. Take almost any song and isolate just the rhythm guitar part and you’d be hard-pressed to identify the song. That’s just reality. Either the rest of the band or the vocals are needed.

Personally, since I believe that I’m less than mediocre as a guitar player, I use it as an excuse to not play when somebody says “oh, you play guitar? Play something!” I just say “I’m a rhythm player. Without the melody you wouldn’t recognize anything I play” and then I don’t have to play for them. :joy:

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Option #1: When the going gets tough, quit.
Just walk away before you end up with a wall of guitars and a stack of amps in a room that can be better utilized for people and other things. God forbid you have sheets of half written songs, jams and half baked brilliant musical ideas. No shame, no judgement – Just walk away now!

Option #2: Reset expectations.
You are not going to deliver a reasonable replica of any of your guitar heroes, and even if you could what would be the point? Strip things down to four down strums per bar and build from that. Find YOUR groove rather then a copy of the original. Go on now, git!

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Hey Nugget. For me when I started the kicker was learning my first song that I could play all the way through. It was Blowin In the Wind and back then it was part of Justin’s beginners song book.

Getting to where I could play it all the way through made a big difference to my motivation. I realized then that I was on my way.

If you can play Horse with no name etc along to the app that’s great progress. See if you can play them to a song sheet with the chords / lyrics on your own.

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Thanks everybody. Apologies for the delay with replying and not quoting individuals, real life getting in the way but all replies greatly appreciated.

Very good advice and good to know that this is a common stumbling block. It’s very hard to know if you’re on the right path when teaching yourself as you have no other peers to compare to.

I guess as others have said I’d like to be able to play something with a bit of melody to show myself more than anyone else that what I’ve learnt is improving things. The problem is I can’t sing whatsoever so that part of it is out so I need a song with a bit of recognisable tune.

Other problem is I’m not that keen really on the play along app thing which does give a bit of backing and fill in the missing bits. Seems more like a computer game where I’m just watching for the next chord to appear rather than learning. I much prefer the song lessons on the website and would like to be able to play along to the original tunes.

I’m alright with some of the strumming patterns that the course has covered, haven’t actually struggled too much with the rhythm side.

Guess I need to get my head down and start putting the stuff altogether. Shall plug on with working class hero as that’s quite a recognisable tune. Have a couple of others I shall add to my practice too.

As @tony said I think it would be a great step for my brain to achieve playing a song through.

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