Madman's Mini Diary OM 8 Dry Runs

OK you ask for it folks. Not a lot of typing so I’ll let the Madman do the introduction.

I have dropped this in as a playlist (Intro, Waiting For A Friend and Amazing) and I don’t really know if the forum platform can cope with that. Lets wait and see. OK It doesn’t so 3 videos above now !!! :rage:

Amazing with backing track to follow in the week.




Back Soon :scream:

So it doesn’t like YT playlist. Videos were Unlisted so should have been visible, now Public.
Feedback welcome.


Hi Toby,
I skipped over to the bottom 2 offerings. I am wondering if this is your “live” OM setup we are hearing? I find the vox good, but to my ears the guitar needs to come up a bit more. It sounds a tad thin perhaps?

No big, but I know you are trying to get this OM signal chain down and thus the comments. I think you will do well with your offerings and I wish you all the best in so doing!

Be well,


The Open Mic was last Saturday, so yes this was my set up going in and also my contingency recording, just in case I hit power or internet issue at the gig. Something I always do and one to compare against the snafus that occur during the event, because it would seem when playing to a live audience even online, there will be clams !

Which song were you listening to, the first vid was just an intro chat, so the “bottom 2” would have been the actual tracks? You got me there Bro. I’d be interested in what you are listening through. Although I am playing with cans on, the levels were checked on playback via external speakers and sound bar, as I tweaked each day during the week’s rehearsals.
So I’d be interested on what other folks think about balance, as it was certainly guitar biased through headphones. Always looking to improve the mix, so value these comments.
That said I’d appreciate your take on the Zoom balance, as a comparison to the Dry Run takes. You’ll find my set at around 36:30 in the video at the top of the link above. Let me know what you think, just ignore the cock ups !!

Cheers my friend, thanks for taking time to listen.


Hey Toby. I dipped in and out of both songs, the dry run and the Zoom.

I’d say sound quality between dry run and Zoom recording was pretty similar.

From a balance perspective I thought it was good. For me the guitar was loud enough to be heard but not over-powering the vocal. Was it a wee bit soft? I guess that comes down to taste. Perhaps it could have been a few dB louder but really fine tuning now and tricky since as non pro singers you may be closer or further from the mic on the night, singing a little louder or softer.

Tone wise, I thought it was OK. Now if you mixed that up and did some multi-tracking, panning etc to produce a home studio version that would create a whole different deal. And maybe LBro’s mental reference is more to that kind of mix.

I think you’ll be doing something more with Amazing, so look forward to that.

Thanks for all the input. As you say some fine tuning and certainly mic position can vary a lot.
I have created a backing track from a GuitarPro Tab for Amazing and have dropped the midi into Reaper. I was not happy with the additional instruments and had to rework the ending to simplify the song, as it all goes a bit mental at the end. I got what I think was a good BT late Thursday but there were some timing issues with my playing over it, so too late to go live with that version. In the next few day I’ll refine that and post. Not sure if its going to be a one take to video but the audio will come in via Reaper, so I can mess with the mix a little, Record the Guitar and Vocal tracks, fine tune the set up and use that mix for a live feed into an OBS video. That’s the plan but watch this space.

Hope all is well in Seattle, take care my man.


I hope so too :wink:

What’s a missing tag between friends ! :rofl:

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Hi Toby,
I took in offering 2 & 3 here (top down) and followed your link to the OM. I am behind the times these days, or so it seems. You have to read close what I said as “a tad” is just that. Meaning - to me, the guitar could come up a bit. I also qualify my my comments based upon subjectivity. Certainly mixing, even more so the whole signal chain setup for the OM’s is a challenge and then some. Thus, that factor is there along with subjectivity.

My mixing cans were used to listen, same Audio Technica ATH M50x I always use.

One thing I noticed was you have your pickup switch on 4, bridge side. Part of the “thin” comment was based upon the guitar tone. I am curious if you were to use the center or more of the neck pups, if it would bring in a bit more of the guitar bottom end? Not sure if you used that pup position on all your tracks or not. I did catch it on one of the OM “live” recordings. I like DavidP found both your contingency recordings and the OM ones of about the same quality and mix.

I think part of what I am hearing is just inherent in the process and signal chain. That is a pretty complex path to get the sound out of and I think honestly it suffers some due to that. That is in general across all performers, more or less.

You also have a lot of dynamics in your vox. So when low in level the mix is probably about right to my ears. But when you fire up the chops a bit more, then it of course overrides the guitar some. Not sure, but I think you are going through the DAW? Can you put some or more (if it is already on), compression on? That would help tame the vox and allow the guitar to come through more. Sometimes I have to stack a couple of compressors up to do what is needed and use each a bit more sparingly. The combined compressors can deal with a lot of variation in the vox though.

I hope the above helps… If not, or if you have questions. You know where to find me… :face_with_peeking_eye:

All is good here, but it has been raining. - What else is new? :slight_smile:

All the best and be well,

Thanks LB.

Yeah I get what you are saying. Regards PUPS I was on the Bridge for Waiting For A Friend and then went to Bridge/Middle for Amazing but that was a last minute change, I’d been using the Bridge all week. Hit 4 by accident pre Dry Run and it sound a little mellower which sorted the song. In the Intro banter I mention that I had just done that and it could have a knock to the balance. Given what you said I’ll be interested in feedback from my daughter, who sound checked all the rehearsals but I never sent her the one using Pos 4 as it was late on and I decided just to go for it.

I may now have a fix to the OBS live Zoom latency which mean I can try through Reaper again. That as you know widens the mixing options but adds complexity to the signal chain. One thing that you say makes sense is varying vocal levels, especially doing Mr Tyler. Maybe I need a Compressor on vocals to even that out ? Capture the power but not wash out the guitar ? Your advice on that would be handy, if you have any. Especially as I’ve just droped another 4 Areosmith tracks into my Songbook App !!! :scream:

Raining in Seattle ? Woulda thunk !!

Be good.


Hi Toby!
I listened to both songs that you posted.
I liked both the sound and the balance between guitar and vocals. Everything is fine with this.
And I always enjoy watching your videos, my friend. Thanks.
May everything be fine with you!

Thanks Leo. Was unsure about restarting the Diary side of things but they are back by popular demand, well at least for now. Glad you enjoyed the songs, I make a regular habit now of recording my last rehearsal before the Open Mic just in case anything goes wrong. To start with I would do them after the show but realised I would be aware of the mistakes brought on by a live performance, so they became more of a second chance. This way, it is more, ok I’ve done all I can do and hope it goes as good at the live event. Hey and maybe one day it will :rofl: but adrenaline does odd things to your fingers and voice when playing live, even online. :scream:

All is good my friend, as are you I hope. :crossed_fingers:


Was it Keith that had a way to use plugins within OBS? If so, that might be a way to toss on some compression without having to add in the DAW and more signal chain length. I have been having some good results of late in my ears by layering compressors on vox. I am pretty sure in industry they compress the heck out of pro recordings. One could also try something like Wave’s Vocal Rider. I used to use it a lot but to me it seems to color the sound and I always wonder about the latency it may be causing.

I think on my end, I have a hard time with the whole Zoom/OBS setup producing quality sound. Mixing is hard enough. Adding in issues via the OM signal chain is a real challenge. If you think about it, that is a tall task. If one is to play live, most of the time you might be able to rely on a live sound guy at the mix board, to help you out. OM has no such help and in fact is challenged by the communication protocols & processes. Not a good combination.

Hey - Some Areosmith would be a good listen! :slight_smile:

All the best,


Yes @majik covered that off in his set up guide from OBS into Zoom using ASIO. So you declare your AI channels in OBS and add FX there, so yeah doable. When I do the Amazing recording with the backing track I set up, I’ll go Reaper to OBS and create the video there and have no issues with latency but with you mentioning Vocal Rider I have experienced some delays using that and some other Waves plugins, they seem to take a while to process the signal. Yes only miliseconds no doubt but noticable.

If I record guitar and vox in Reaper while recording the video and audio in OBS, I will be able to go back and mix the Reaper audio and the add that to a muted video (ie drop the video into Reaper and line it all up). So hopefully there maybe something by the end of the week.



All sounded good to me Toby, I think so far best balance you achieved so far. Dry runs as good as live performances however I prefered live as extra adrenaline was clearly pumping through your veins and made it even better!

Thank Adi, especially the comments on balance.

As regard live v dry, that adrenaline causes more screw ups though. Have to see how the backing track version comes out, as its back to the drawing board on balance and guitar tone. Found something last night but for the life of me could not sing and play over the the BT and record video at the same time. Even reverting to multi track failed as I was singing flat !! It was like starting over. :angry: So revisiting the BT as something is awry !

So when are you going to sing AND play Black Betty ?


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Both songs sounded good to me. For me the balance between vocals ad guitar were ok. Perhaps your best performances to date.

Gawd bless you Trevor !

As in software wise or just couldn’t physically? Whether one or another as with everything it takes some time and I am sure one of the next OMs you will crack it :wink:

Haha I was really tempted you know, but one thing that holds me up is the last bit where you do the upstrums and you jump to two notes 5th fret and a massive bend on 12th fret B string- my head is too focused on those jumps around the fretboard so to pull off this bit more complicated vox lines completely messes it all up :grinning: so perhaps maybe one day :smiley:

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