Need some understanding and clarity on solos I transcribed and am learning

rachelcoles · May 16, 2025, 11:42am

Hi All,

I was transcribing some solos I wanted to learn and I noticed something and I just need some clarity…

The amount of the bars in the solos were all over the place and I just need to understand something.

Example 1 - GM Solo (1 3 4 5 progression Gm Bb C D)
The bar count was as follows…
GM-14 Bb -1 Gm-1 C-6 D-2 Gm-6 Bb-1 Gm-1 Bb-1 Gm-1 Bb-1 Gm-1
So if I select a different Gm backing track to the one used, do I have to find a backing track with the same bar count progression or just one that has the same chords?
If I find one with the same chords but different bar count, can I still play the solo exactly as it is, or would I have to change the solo to correlate to the chord progression in the backing track?
What happens if you cannot find a Gm backing track with the exact same chords?

Example 2 - E (1 4 5 progression E A D)
Seems a little more standard…
E-4 A-2 E-2 B7-2 E-6 A-2 E-2 B7-2 E-6 A-2 E-2 B7-2 E-6 A-2 E-2 B7-2 E-2

Is that because it’s a 1 4 5 progression?

Example 3 - Albert King Solo in A by Justin (A D E) from his “Really useful Blues Solos” book
A-4 D-2 A-2 E-2 A-6 D-2 A-2 E-2 A-2
Similar to Example 2

If you need to see the transcriptions let me know. The only one I cannot upload is Example 3 by JS and I think I might get into trouble if I do (I bought the book, but I think I cannot display due to copyright…someone will tell me if this is correct)

Example 4
I created a solo in A in std 12 bar blues (A7 D7 E7) and was playing it over a Jam track from JS Jam Volumes and I notice the chord progression of BK was different to the solo…
It was A7 D7 A A7 D7 Eb A A E7 D7 A E7 (1 4 1 1 4 5 1 1 5 4 1 5)

So was I playing the progression all wrong
See attached first 12 bars of example 4 solo

So it’s super confusing…
Do I have to listen to the backing track first to hear the bar count etc…
Hope I wrote my question correctly…

jjw · May 16, 2025, 12:33pm

This is a straight 12-bar blues in E. It’s a bit more obvious like this:

E  E  E E 
A  A  E E 
B7 B7 E E

E  E  E E 
A  A  E E 
B7 B7 E E, etc,

The 12-bar pattern is repeated 4 times in your example.

Same thing here, but key of A: the A-6 is the last 2 bars of the 1st chorus and the first 4 bars of the 2nd.

I’m not an expert on soloing, but I think solos generally are specific to the underlying chords. If you learn a solo note-for-note, that has to be played over the exact chord progression (same chords for the same number of bars). That’s because the soloist will generally target chord tones and if you change the underlying chords, it won’t sound right.

rachelcoles · May 16, 2025, 12:51pm

Hi,

So I was playing the wrong chords over the backing track in example 4? I should have been playing over a std 12 bar progression in A.

jjw · May 16, 2025, 1:28pm

I’m confused. Are you playing chords over the backing track? Or a transcribed solo?

Also, you listed the chords in your example, but your TAB shows slightly different chords. I don’t understand where the 2 sets of chords come from.

rachelcoles · May 16, 2025, 2:13pm

I was playing the transcribed solo which I attached over the backing track mentioned example 4, so this progression A7 D7 A A7 D7 Eb A A E7 D7 A E7

jjw · May 16, 2025, 4:09pm

Ok. So that backing track chord progression is the same as appears on your solo TAB except for bars 2 and 6. The backing track has a D in bar 2, instead of an A. This is a common variation (called “quick change”) on the 12-bar blues. Regarding the solo, bar 2 has only an A note, which is fine over the D chord (it’s a chord tone actually).

Regarding bar 6, that Eb looks very strange to me, that bar would usually be a D (as in your TAB). So, does bar 6 of the solo sound okay over an Eb chord? The Eb chord is composed of the notes Eb, G and Bb. The notes played in bar 6 of the solo are: E, G, A and C. So, you will potentially be hearing an E and Eb at the same time, and also possibly an A and a Bb. These note pairs are separated by a semi-tone, and may not sound so great.

But I hope an expert like @Richard_close2u will give us his take.

Richard_close2u · May 17, 2025, 6:39am

If this piece of music is in the key of G minor, you need to correct some of your analysis first.

G minor scale:

G    A    Bb    C    D    Eb    F    G
1    2    3     4    5    6     7    1

Diatonic chords of G minor:

Gm    Adim    Bb     Cm    Dm    Eb    F      Gm
i     ii      III    iv    v     VI    VII    i

Therefore, the chords you list are not all diatonic.

Gm = the i chord.
Bb = the III chord
C = the IV chord (a non diatonic major)
D = the V chord (a non diatonic major)

The bar count was as follows…
GM-14 Bb -1 Gm-1 C-6 D-2 Gm-6 Bb-1 Gm-1 Bb-1 Gm-1 Bb-1 Gm-1

Arranging chord progressions in rows of 4 or 8 can often help find patterns.

| Gm | Gm | Gm | Gm | Gm | Gm | Gm | Gm |

| Gm | Gm | Gm | Gm | Gm | Gm | Bb | Gm |

| C  | C  | C  | C  | C  | C  | D  | D  | 

| Gm | Gm | Gm | Gm | Gm | Gm | Bb | Gm |

| Bb | Gm | Bb | Gm |

There are 36 bars. The above is one possible arrangement. Seen like this, the first 16 bars are a simple tonic chord vamp in G minor with an occasional on1-bar step to the III chord of Bb major. The final 12-bar section is the same though towards its end makes a few extra and more frequent i to III steps.
A solo or lead part or improvisation over this progression can be wholly G minor scale. Or, because it hovers around Gm for so long and only occasionally goes to the III chord, it could also be G Dorian or G Phrygian because they are also minor-type scales. But let’s keep the focus tight and think only of G minor.

The middle section contains two major chords whose root notes are in the key of G minor, but the diatonic triads would be Cm and Dm respectively. These are non-diatonic. But they form a large chunk of the progression and it is perhaps better to view this as a key change. Or a move to a different musical moment.
Two major chords one whole tone apart could be the IV and V of a key. Which key? Mmmh, interestingly, the key of G major. That represents a key change to the parallel major key.
Or, it could be viewed as C Lydian. Or it could be viewed as D Mixolydian. But let’s keep it simple and think only of G major.

If I find one with the same chords but different bar count, can I still play the solo exactly as it is, or would I have to change the solo to correlate to the chord progression in the backing track?

It is not possible to answer that without knowing your solo. Because your solo may actually move away from G minor for the main sections and into somewhere that is not G major for the sub-section.
My instinct is to think that your solo will be specific to that progression.

What happens if you cannot find a Gm backing track with the exact same chords?

You can record a backing track yourself or - perhaps even better - having done all the hard work of transcribing, use the licks, phrases, melodic motifs and ideas and adapt then, steal them, make them you own so you can play over any G-minor-ish backing track.

Richard_close2u · May 17, 2025, 6:41am

Exactly this. Again, counting and arranging in rows of 4 or 8 makes everything come together and patterns are revealed.

Richard_close2u · May 17, 2025, 6:55am

Which specific track?

I notice the chord progression of BK was different to the solo…

This is confusing Rachel. The backing track contains a chord progression? And you played a solo?
Do you mean you played a solo but it did not match the chords?

It was A7 D7 A A7 D7 Eb A A E7 D7 A E7 (1 4 1 1 4 5 1 1 5 4 1 5)

Are you sure this is the progression?

| A7 | D7 | A7 | A7 |
| D7 | Eb | A7 | A7 |
| E7 | D7 | A7 | E7 |

So was I playing the progression all wrong.

I’m confused here too. Please can you explain this again.

See attached first 12 bars of example 4 solo

Do I have to listen to the backing track first to hear the bar count etc…

If you want to gain a fuller understanding, and to play a solo that makes musical sense, knowing the chord progression is a really important consideration. You can solo using a given scale if you know that key of the progression, and that it is diatonic. That can work. But knowing the chords puts you in a better place.

rachelcoles · May 17, 2025, 7:26am

Hi Richard,

Thank you for the detailed explanation. I will have to reread it to fully understand it, but from what I can understand.

GM Solo:
So I can take specific phases and clicks as use them over a different Gm backing track of my choice in whatever chord progression I want?
I’ve attached Gm Solo…

Example 4:
The backing track is called “Sweet Little BB (Blues Backing Track in A)” from Jam Blues Vol 2
I’ve attached the complete solo I created, it’s not completely finished but 95%, still some tweaks to be done as some parts don’t fit nicely. I have also shared a link to to be playing the first 24 bars over the backing track

(My Solo)

Gm_Solo:

My Solo:

Richard_close2u · May 17, 2025, 7:35am

Hi Rachel - thanks for sharing tab … is that created on Guitar Pro?
If yes, could you email me copies. I would be glad to edit / tweak / sort them a little for you. The reason I’m suggesting that is that your use of the ‘Repeat’ is confusing. I would also space your bars to be equal width, putt he music in the correct key signature etc. You shouldn’t have any # accidentals in the key of Gm as all accidentals should be flat.

Richard_close2u · May 17, 2025, 8:32am

Ah yes, it does contain A and A7 chords.
The E flat type chord is Eb minor7 flat 5 (Ebm7b5). An extension of a diminished Eb triad.
I am working on it on Guitar Pro now.

rachelcoles · May 17, 2025, 8:44am

Hi Richard,

Both were created in Guitar Pro. I’ll email them both over so you can tweak them.
Thank you

Richard_close2u · May 17, 2025, 10:52am

Rachel …

Firstly, congratulations and kudos for transcribing solos, notating in Guitar Pro, recording yourself playing your improv. solos and transcribing those and more. That is great stuff.

You deserve this …

Also … fao anybody else with an interest in this.

Your Guitar Pro transcription is in 4/4 and the Sweet Little BB is in 12/8. Justin does a 4-count before it starts but that is the ‘fell’ not the time signature.

I therefore didn’t really make use of your tab, I followed your recording and transcribed myself from scratch.

TAB and audio below.

A few things I did.
The count in is an Anacrusis bar. I named it as such - so it does not have a number above. I placed it as a single bar on its own row at the top.
The 12-bar progression I then arranged in 4-bars per row using Bar → System Layout.
I have a basic blues organ providing chords that are held and sustained for the full bars and I have a very simple drum marking the four strong pulses and the 12 eighths.

I hope that is useful.

rachelcoles · May 17, 2025, 11:59am

Hi Richard,

Thank you so much for the kind words and especially for taking the time to re-transcribe the solo.
I’ll practise the new solo and then re-record it, and also give it a go at amending the rest of the solo to fit over the correct time signature.
I find it very interesting/fun transcribing solos as to me it’s a good way to learn how to improvise and also how songs/solos are put together.
I have a lot to learn, and asking for help and advise from our community and yourself does make understanding it easier.

Thank you again

Ontime · May 20, 2025, 1:33pm

Good job working with GP. Super valuble I just started working with it recently my self and I really like it. Keep kicking butt. You are on your way to becomeing a true blueswomen.