Playing campfire songs as a rhythm guitar player

I am not sure anyone would want to hear the song with just the rhythm guitar strumming, whether they recognised it or not :thinking:
Songs are melodies, usually with words.
Not many people would like to listen to the drum or bass parts of a song at a party on their own. Simple strumming of a chord progression on itā€™s own becomes tedious quite quickly. If you can incorporate melody notes in the tune, thatā€™s a different story.
Bringing a couple of lyric sheets, so people can sing along is one solution :smiley:

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Hey @TonyHS, Iā€™ve been struggling with this issue since I picked up a guitar many years ago. I think the answer depends on if you really want to perform songs for other people (around a campfire or elsewhere), or if you are looking for ways to add to your basic rhythm playing to make a song more interesting (but not necessarily appropriate for an instrumental performance).

If itā€™s the former (performing for people), then I agree that you really do need somebody to sing. Playing through a chord progression without any vocals around a campfire is not gonna be great. Even if you add some riffage (like in Heart of Gold, say), imo itā€™s not enough to make the song interesting as an instrumental (well, maybe if youā€™re playing for your mother :wink:). If others are willing to sing while you play, then youā€™re all set. There is the problem of people not knowing all the lyrics, as Rogier noted. You could just play as much as people know: the 1st verse, couple of choruses and thatā€™s it. Or people could pull out their phones and find the lyrics online.

Iā€™m mostly in the 2nd category: wanting to play songs that I recognize and get satisfaction playing, beyond the chord progression. To that end, Iā€™ve learned songs with some recognizable riffs, lead lines, etc, like Wish You Were Here, various Neil Young songs (Hey, Hey, My, My, Needle and the Damage Done, Heart of Gold), Simple Man, Wonderful Tonight, Ripple, etc. I sometimes play these along with the original recordings, sometimes I just sing along in my head (the best place for my vocals!)

More recently, Iā€™ve focused on fingerstyle acoustic folk/blues instrumental pieces and Iā€™ve learned a handful of songs. These could be played for an audience (if I had one!), but they are more advanced.

Thanks for all the replies. It would seem that campfire playing is out of the window at the moment :frowning:

I will continue being the backing until I can make my guitar sing,

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@jjw thank you. Thinking about it, I think that I am in the 2nd category. I would love to perform instrumentals, and this is my long term goal. At the moment I need to work on playing the song so thatā€™s recognisable to me without the backing track. Thank you for getting me to think deeper into what I really want.

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Hi Tony,
Good discussion happening here for sure.
Justin did an excellent lesson on ā€œHow not to suck at singingā€ that you can find on the main site.
Designed especially for anyone with these sorts of doubts and questions, for people who want to give it a go, but who donā€™t consider themselves great singers. I reckon youā€™d find it really helpful
Cheers
Ruaridh

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Hi Tony. I raised a similar topic here and got some interesting responses although the bottom line is unless you can play finger style instrumental stuff you need to have a singer.
Christmas/New Year party singalongs

100% agree with that. Itā€™s fine for learning to play guitar and posting as an AVOYP here, but no use in the real world.

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@Eccleshall thanks, I have watched that once, will probably have to watch it again, but as far as Iā€™m concerned, those like me who cannot sing and activity dislike singing should take the hint and not sing :wink:

@sairfingers I agree, the only way I can solo will be by doing full instrumentals.

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Perhaps it is better to stay away from ā€˜no one likes or everyone wantsā€™ because there have already been examples that this does not applyā€¦ a good rhythm guitarist can make parts (or a large part) of a well-known song sound interesting. ā€¦ especially if the group around the fire consists of people who once tried something in their bedroom for a few hours ā€¦ I was one of them and so were a few of my acquaintances and 1 friend (last Saturday discussed extensively at a party about making ā€œsimpleā€ chord progressions without singing interesting ā€¦ ) 15 times a well-known song of 1 minute is already fifteen minutes of fun and who knows who will sing along with it ā€¦ if the guitar is there, just pick it up and the audience is not in the mood for itā€¦ you are probably still alive and did something that no one was doing there at that moment, otherwise it would have been playedā€¦
just first learn 1 song very well and recognizable and turn it into a 1 or 2 minute songā€¦ see how people react and who sings alongā€¦

Donā€™t avoid itā€¦it can lead to some really fun momentsā€¦I know it :sunglasses:
Greetings

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Thatā€™s a really good point Rogier well said.

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Repeating myself by saying this, but in a slightly different form:
build up in layers

Song choice

1: pick songs that have recognizable chord progressions (like mentioned above)

Embellisment

2: learn to embellish your chords to make them more interesting
3: find out which embellishments you can use to emulate some of the vocal melody

broaden skill set

4: consider adding rhythm with percussive hits and mutes
5: give fingerpicking a go to alternate fingerpicking and strumming to match verses and choruses or vocal sections
6: be brave and give singing a go :wink:

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Thank you Lieven, thatā€™s got to be my next objective.

Just to make it clear, I really have no interest in singing :wink:

Hi Tony - I hear you, but Iā€™m going to say this anyway ā€¦ :rofl:

I felt exactly the same for the longest time ā€¦ I mean decades.
In the end I gave in and using a capo found a song or two that I felt I didnā€™t completely murder. I think that most people think they canā€™t sing (including me), but Iā€™ve found people are much more likely to join in if you start them off and in my case not being great meant I set the bar real low and made it easier for people to join in. You could find something you can ā€˜talk singā€™ as Justin calls it. Youā€™ll most likely find there are a couple of songs you can get though and the more you do it the easier it becomes.

Anyhow, you made it clear you donā€™t want to sing and thatā€™s also cool, thereā€™s some great advice here to entertain without it, but as it adds another dimension I thought Iā€™d share my 2c worth in case anyone else was following.
cheers
Paul.

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@roger_holland
Hi Rogier. Iā€™ve said this before somewhere on the Forum. It depends if youā€™re playing ā€˜forā€™ other people or ā€˜withā€˜ other people.

If playing ā€˜forā€™ people, then itā€™s doubtful if youā€™d get away with strumming the melody, no matter how many embellishments etc you fit in.

If playing ā€˜withā€™ people, someone may join in with a vocal or another instrument in which case, yes, some strumming, basic or otherwise, might get things going.

Hi Gordon,
Not with a lot of people I know and the parties or visits I attend ā€¦ and certainly not when I play a chord progression with many embellishments like what Lieven indicates above and I actually do above that because with a simple adjustment in the strumming pattern with picking some individual notes in between , something like Hotel California can sound very nice for (just tested for almost 2 minutes), with a simple hammer on and chords strumming and that can be a lot of fun for bystanders if you donā€™t make it too longā€¦ of course you and many others may not like that at all when someone does that, but I and some others quite enjoy and enjoyed that ā€¦
and especially if you are a novice guitarist and those around you also regularly play an instrument, you should just seize the opportunity and not be guided by the possible reservations of others ā€¦ donā€™t stretch it too long because they might wrap the guitar around your head , but a limited guitarist (including myself a while ago) who only plays a few chords can make a room clap along or even sing ā€¦ and if not, then not , but if you donā€™t hit, you always mis :sunglasses:
Just try and find out ā€¦you are probably with friends and/or acquaintances its fun :smiley:

And if you mean "for people " on a podium in front of strangersā€¦ than you probbably drunk then :laughing:
Greetings

Ps : I usually pick up the guitar in a corner of the room or I pretend ( sometimes real) that I want to let a person hear or see something on the guitar or piano ā€¦ so I ā€œtasteā€ whether there is interest in the roomā€¦and than try something like the songs above

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Hi Tony, I would venture that playing some chords to a well known song and you not singing would bring forth, without too much encouragement, and the emphasis on ā€˜well knownā€™, voices joining in with the song. Your problem of not singing solved. :smiley:

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I hear what you are asking, but Iā€™m not sure that you are asking the right questions.

Play what you can play now as a rhythm guitarist, but learn to add vocals and playing dynamics. Vocals are the difference between a chord progression and a song. Strumfests get boring quickly because a lot of players forget that we donā€™t have to hit all six strings on every strum and fail to add nuances like muted strums and volume changes (chorus vs verse, etc).

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As a young teenager, one of my friends played the guitar and learned the chords for the latest chart hit Uriah Heepā€™s Lady in Black
He played it for the class, and my jaw dropped. Three minutes of switching between Am & G. (I was mortified for him and thought he must have learned the wrong song :rofl:)
If you are in a gathering and play or sing something that encourages others to join with, youā€™re on a winner :smiley:
If no one knows the song or folk start paying attention to what youā€™re playing, it becomes more of a ā€˜performanceā€™ and, while everyone will be rooting for you, it can become embarrassing if you donā€™t play well or make it interesting.
As @mathsjunky said above, the spoken song is a good alternative
Take a look at Johnny Cashā€™s Boy named Sue-
Three chords (ADE), same progression from top to bottom. He sings only the last couple of notes in each verse. So entertaining :laughing:
(William Shatner has perfected the art :rofl:)

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Hi Brian,
So your advice is that no one should pick up a guitar in a room if he can only play some swinging chords with small additions but without singingā€¦ or singing from someone elseā€¦ your example misses the point for meā€¦ .in any case, as I imagined itā€¦I have done it several times myself and seen it around me ā€¦
I have also experienced your example of the boy in class in a living room, both done by myself many years ago and seen others ā€œdieā€, but ā€¦ Now we are talking about people who practice their chords every day (not everyone, yes) and can play a nice rhythm for 1 or 2 minutes, varied in dynamics etcā€¦ I like listening to that :sunglasses:
Greetings

Edit : 1:10 minutes of fun if you play it a little slower

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Hi Tony, a lot of good advice has already been offered. Iā€™ve been questioning a lot with my ownself about Rhythm Guitar and Melody in the past. If Iā€™m understanding well youā€™ll be working on embellishments and Dynamics so I thoughtā€¦why not trying to follow a side path to this where you start from a simple melody and you work out ā€œwhat can I add to make a single note melody sound fuller and more interesting to the ear?ā€ Itā€™s a very interesting thing to do because it engages your ear in the first place and all yourself! On one hand you would start from the Rhythm, on the other one you would start from the Melody.

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I want to play classical and fingerstyle, donā€™t have a great singing voice/range, donā€™t have confidence singing and have ā€œnot wanted to singā€ with my guitar.

However, I recently came to a few new realizations. First, I am an adult and shouldnā€™t care what other people think. Second, and an important one, is that when you play for friends and family, nobody really cares that you arenā€™t the greatest singer, it just about the fun. Third, melody is important for rounding out the presentation of music and melody can be carried with certain notes, embellishment, dynamics and, of course, voice.
Finally, and the most important, singing, however horribly while playing guitar is super fun and fulfilling.

Sure, it is difficult. A bit like patting your head and rubbing your tummy at the same time but much, much harder.

But why sweat it? Learn the song well, learn to coarsely bark out the song with it, refine a little over time and you will have fun, and as long as you arenā€™t charging them, your friendly audience will have fun along with you.

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