Songbook - what do you do once you get to more complicated songs?

Some great ideas already, thanks guys, Iā€™m going to refrain from commenting for now and let the conversation run for a bit :smiley:.

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Thatā€™s super!

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At this point in time and a couple of years in with this guitar playing thing I would say that I havenā€™t memorised one complete song, and actually donā€™t see the point due to my lack of singing ability. I can play bits of lots of songs though!

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Iā€™m like Guitar George, (without knowing all the chords :wink:)
Itā€™s strictly rhythm- I donā€™t want to make it cry or sing :rofl:
(Lyrics and chords only in my word processor)

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Iā€™m a bit like Shane but electronically as If I wrote something down a few months down the line I would need someone to help decipher what I wrote.

Iā€™ll produce a song and lyric sheet on word. Take for example. At the top of the sheet Iā€™ll paste the chords used in the song from my chord book generated using Neck Diagrams. If the intro is a picked pattern Iā€™ll put it together on Guitar Pro and simplify the view and then paste that onto the song sheet. Then for the verses Iā€™ll just write the lyrics with the chords annotated above the lyrics. If there is a specific strumming pattern Iā€™ve decided on using Iā€™ll just add that above the verse. If the instrumental repeats Iā€™ll just make note and refer back to the intro picking etc.

Edit: for fingerstyle songs I just use Guitar Pro

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As @stitch mentioned earlier I use Songbook Pro.

I used to write everything down manually in a journal including tabbed riffs etc not just lyrics and chords. Then I think @Rossco01 recommended Setlist Helper which although it runs as an independent app uses a browser interface to manage and populate. I moved to Songbook Pro, as it runs as an app on the desktop and all my mobile devices and can be kept in sync by backing up to the cloud. The feature I liked was the ability to import chord sheets direct from UltimateGuitar, along with Chordpro and txt files (see examples below). The ability to edit allowing for corrections. There is automatic scrolling which can be adjusted tempo wise to provide a visual aid while you are playing.

Add to that the ability to create and edit setlist it was a no brainer and portable across all my mobile device on a single licence. :sunglasses:

I would add there is a weird ā€œdroneā€ for the song Key that can be select, which will play as the song scrolls from start to finish. I really need to find out more about it, as its not something I use. I added a new song yesterday evening clicked on it by accident and found it served no benefit than to stop me playing. So I suspect it could be a feature my wife somehow added ! :rofl:

From UG

From TXT file

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Oops nearly forgot, you can import via PDF as well. So this means you can take a song based on GuitarPro, export that as PDF and add it to Songbook Pro !

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Iā€™m not a rote player and Iā€™ve moved away from being an archivist (aside from just recording my playing). Thatā€™s it, record and then move on to the next thing. Itā€™s far more interesting where Iā€™m going than where Iā€™ve been.

Iā€™m not going to forget the building blocks of songs and progressions. The fretboard, chords, chords in a key, Nashville numbering, scales, etc are all going to be there. The words to songs can be mucked around with as needed. The fact that a particular song moves to an E min in this particular spot is less important than we all think. :slight_smile:

EDIT: I worked for an early Internet music related company where I learned the saying, ā€œRelax! Itā€™s only music.ā€ LOL

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I guess itā€™s a question of whatā€™s it for?

Iā€™m not that organised, so have a random collection of mainly YouTube bookmarks with my ā€˜favouritesā€™.

Iā€™m with CT here, I find it a lot easier to remember songs if I learn them ā€˜my wayā€™. Iā€™ll learn from a few sources and just take elements from each, - with the elements usually being the least complex :shushing_face:
As long as Iā€™m happy with the song ā€˜vibeā€™ Iā€™m good.

For performing, I usually stick to practicing a couple of songs in the run-up. If I canā€™t get to the point of remembering those at home Iā€™d have no chance playing them live, with or without a songbook. That said, the last time I tried an impromptu ā€˜second setā€™ for songs Iā€™d play all day at home just vanished with the nerves, so I now take a backup lyrics bookā€¦

But think it does take away from your performance if youā€™re staring down at a music stand.

I have noticed, when attending the open mics, most other performers have both lyrics and chords in their songbooks and most do use themā€¦ but they are at a more advanced stage I guess where they just rock up and decide, literally as they are setting up, what they are going to perform from a large ā€˜back catalogueā€™.

Finally, I stick to songs I love. Itā€™s maybe bad form or short sighted but that way itā€™s not a chore.

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With you on that Dave. I tend to use the Songbook as an aid to practice and rehearsal, if you like. For the first few OMs here I used it as a crutch, it was then on the tablet but not referenced. After the first half dozen or less I no longer felt a need for it come kick off. But that was more time spent learning a new song or playing songs written in my soul. My 2 cts.
:sunglasses:

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I still use setlist helper and it works well on my tablet and I like the browser interface. I suspect Songbook Pro is better but Iā€™ve not looked. One big plus is importing chord sheets. I tend to use a ā€œsong formatterā€. I copy and paste into it from ultimate guitar and then it will reverse format for setlist helper. The SongPro feature to do this sounds a definite bonus.

Itā€™s an essential tool for me now because weā€™re running at 35+ songs for the band. The setlist builder allows me to build different set lists for each gig and during a gig itā€™s a useful crutch if your mind goes blank on a songā€¦ plus for those songs played less frequently itā€™s easy just to revisit the chord sheet during practice.

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Song Formater/Importer (Beta) from UkeGeeks Labs this one maybe ? Should folks be interested. :sunglasses:

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Do you use a foot control to turn pages and move to the next song? Also, do you find it a distraction to turn pages, read and such while staying on time and in the pocket?

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Setlist Helper is digital and autoscrolls, so no need to turn pages and a single swipe takes you to the next song in the set.

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Got it. So you just need to follow along with the screen. So it would be reading, singing, playing and staying in the pocket.

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Canā€™t speak for Jason but when I used Setlist Helper during the early OMs it was more a reminder and you kinda went on auto pilot - not actually reading chords and lyrics while performing but it was there as a reference in case you had some brain fade. Its almost a quick look and the songs is in your head and off you go.

Jasonā€™s situation with 35 songs on the playlist could be different. Just MHO.

Even now when I use the latest app (Songbook) for practice/rehearsal, the songs are pretty much in grained so its just a back stop.

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As Toby says it auto scrolls.

So I have all my songs in a setlist, see the next song, hit ā€œplayā€ and itā€™ll auto scroll ( at the speed I set ). Remember I know these songs backwards so for performance itā€™s just a backup. Playing (and singing) is pretty automatic and if anything itā€™s the odd lyric I forgetā€¦ so Iā€™m just scanning when I need toā€¦ most of my eye contact is with the audience.

In the studio I use it a lot more for remembering or working on new songs where I do follow it moreā€¦ it becomes second nature after a while.

I can even manually scroll with my finger for most songs ( if itā€™s going a little slow ) without breaking the rhythm.

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For me, the answer depends on what Iā€™m doing.

I have a collection of ā€œsongbook styleā€ sheets that are just chords and lyrics. No tab, no standard notation, etc. Maybe a time signature or some notes about a capo or bpm. These are just text files that I print out and put in a binder. Itā€™s mainly a spur for my memory, and mostly singer/songwriter kind of stuff that Iā€™d be likely to play and sing with just an acoustic guitar. (Thinking about it, I rarely use any form of written music if Iā€™m playing electric guitar, unless itā€™s jazz and weā€™re using lead sheets.)

I use ā€œlead sheetsā€ for some things. These are ā€œReal Book styleā€ sheets with the melody/head written in standard notation and the chords/harmony notated above the staff. Lyrics might be notated below. Obviously pretty common for jazz stuff, and also common if itā€™s a song Iā€™ve composed myself. I like to write my own compositions down in standard notation so I have a written record of the melody, in particular. I create lead sheets with the lilypond software.

Lastly, sometimes Iā€™ll use scores in standard notation. This is most common for songs Iā€™ve composed and that have multiple instruments, or for songs where I took music for another instrument and made my own arrangement, or for classical music.

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Interesting to see others approach, I find a few suggestion quite useful for the future if I ever going to step into the outside world with my guitar.

As to my current approach - everything that is strum da dum I just use websites to open up chord sheet and lyrics. I print out lyrics only when I sing along and practice or perform during OM nights as a little help to prevent me from forgetting lyrics. I donā€™t keep songbook for that purpose, just donā€™t feel the need.

As to more complex stuff wellā€¦ i donā€™t have that many under my sleeve (yet) but whenever I transcribe something I do it on A4 sheet of paper with grid printed off, then either keep those pieces together or rewrite it into my notebook. Simples :wink: no rhythm, no counting - just notes or chords.

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Black Betty, Scar Tissue, Snow?