Swapping out pickups, pots and switch

[Lefteris]

Hi Stefan @SgtColon!

Sorry if I confused more with my questions.

@SgtColon

I have no idea. Can anyone else answer this please?

My Epiphone has that from the factory. I like it.
Not sure about my Ibanez but I haven’t put it on my SSS guitar.
I think it’s preference. Resistors are sold for peanuts, get one and you can put it on at any time.
Some references: Seymour Duncan 3 Popular Treble Bleed Mods: What You Need to Kno and
https://www.fender.com/articles/maintenance/how-a-treble-bleed-circuit-can-affect-your-tone
Bonus reference on capacitors: Seymour Duncan What Tone Capacitors Do I Need For My Guitar? - Guitar Pickups, Bass Pickups, Pedals

@SgtColon

I thought they would all be the same size

Some have longer shafts I think. Best make sure
I had to use a lot of washers as spacers on my SSS because of that (otherwise there would be a huge gap between the knob and pickguard) but fortunately the cavity was also deep enough to accommodate them.

@SgtColon

Again, I just thought they would all be the same size.

Usually those knobs on the inside have some splines or “teeth”. Some have 18, some have 24.
They match the teeth of the pots. The pots you showed have 24. Regardless of whether you’re keeping the knobs you already have or buying new, that number will guide the choice.

@SgtColon

What will the wire be for? Do I not get the wires I need when I buy the pickups?

The pickups have their own wires to connect them to the selector switch and potentiometers.
You need some more wire for the ground connections and to connect the selector switch with the volume pot, the volume pot with the output jack and make the connections between tone and volume pots. Ask IronGear to send you a wiring diagram for an HSS (they don’t seem to have one on their website).

I hope I’m not confusing you more!

[Majik]

@SgtColon

What is the difference between 500 and 250

That’s a question with a complex technical answer.

Without going into too much detail of electronics, electronic components have various characteristics which work together to affect the signal. The pickups may, for instance, have a high or low output depending on the construction.

Resistance is, like it sounds, something which “resists” the flow of electrical signal.

For the “volume” control on the guitar, the resistance (measured in ohms, symbol Ω) between the input from the pickups and the output jack will affect how much of the signal gets through: the bigger the resistance, the less signal get through. The volume control is a potentiometer (or “pot”) which is, basically, a variable resistance device which goes from low resistance to high resistance. The rating is the highest resistance that the pot will go to.

So a 250kΩ pot will adjust between (approximately) 0 Ω to 250kΩ (kΩ is 1,000 Ω). When you turn the volume fully “up”, to allow the maximum signal to be sent to the amp, the resistance of the pot is nearly 0Ω. When you turn it fully off, the resistance is at the maximum (either 250kΩ or 500kΩ).

At the halfway point, it’s somewhere between the two. A linear 500kΩ pot will have a resistance of around 250kΩ at its halfway setting.

If you compare a linear 500kΩ and 250kΩ pot as a volume control, turning down a 500kΩ pot will reduce the output level approximately twice as quickly as turning down a 250kΩ pot.

Or, put another way, the 500kΩ pot set halfway will be the same signal level as the 250kΩ pot when fully off.

The impact on the tone control is similar, although it’s a fair bit more complex to explain why.

@SgtColon

what factors make you need one over the other?

Basically, the other components, especially the pickups. As i said, pickups can be high or low output (or somewhere inbetween).

If you, for instance, use a 250kΩ pot with a high-output pickup where a 500kΩ pot should really be used, then you could find the volume control of the guitar won’t turn fully off.

Cheers,

Keith

[TheMadman_tobyjenner]

@SgtColon

@TheMadman_tobyjenner Thanks for the link Toby but none of your pictures are loading in for me.

Very odd, will do some digging

[Majik]

By the the way, putting a resistor in won’t exactly replicate a 250k pot, for various reasons, but it is probably good enough.

Cheers,

Keith

[snoxracr]

or you could always wire it up EVH Frankie style

[SgtColon]

@Lefteris Not at all. You just always think something is going to be quite easy until you start it. I’d prefer to have as much knowledge as possible before getting going.

Thank you for the links, that was interesting reading and very informative. Also, I’ll do some measuring, as I don’t want to be buying and having to return stuff. Thanks, I’ll also count the teeth as well. Ahh, okay, again, I just thought all the wires would be there I’ll ask them for a diagram. Thanks.

@Majik Thank you Keith. That was an interesting read and I think I get the crux of it. It is amazing what is inside your guitar that you never really give much thought to.

@TheMadman_tobyjenner Thank you Toby.

@snoxracr It will probably end up looking something like that anyway Tony but just not working as well.

Another questions I’ve just thought. I now know I need a capacitor and resistor on the volume pot, do I also need to have a capacitor on both tones pots as well?

[sequences]

Doing my morning reading… You are getting a lot of tips here, most you can use, some may not be necessary.

Can you open up your guitar now and take a picture of pickup wiring and pot wiring? We can give you more specific guidance. I know my original thought was just a raw replacement, but I see Lefteris seems to be thinking about a harness commonly used for fast assembly, or needing to add wiring. This should help with the fine details of the swapping.

[artax_2]

So for those in this thread that have Texas Locos- I purchased two last month and did a swap on my Schecter’s neck and middle pickups. I have to say, I was a little underwhelmed with them. They weren’t as loud in terms of output volume as the ones I replaced (Schecter house made Diamond Series single coils). They’re in phase and all that jazz, I did extensive testing to make sure they were the right polarity and such. What could be the reason they put out less volume than I expected?

[sequences]

Hi @artax_2

Fewer turns of the fine wire around the bobbin will produce lower output voltages. The number of turns is a part of the design of the pickup. There are several tradeoffs to make in the design. Notably, desired output level and frequency response are determined by turns.

Higher output level will drive amps harder and put your sound into distortion earlier. More turns shift the level vs frequency peak and rolloff of the pickup lower in frequency, changing how the pickup sounds / responds to your picking.

Don’t judge the pickup on the level versus another’s level. Adjust the amp (or pedal) gain to compensate. You want to judge the timbre and clarity of the pickup to see if it meets your mental goal for tone.

[TheMadman_tobyjenner]

That’s why I went for Smoke Stack II with twin coils, even split its pretty hot, that and a couple of Hammer Heads made a snarly HSH set up.

[Lefteris]

@artax_2

They weren’t as loud in terms of output volume as the ones I replaced

In addition to what Michael said, did you try raising them closer to the strings?

[artax_2]

Good suggestion, but yes I did. They were high enough that the string could easily be affected by the magnetic field from the pole pieces. It resulted in a volume increase that I was happy with, however, the pickups were just too close to the strings, so I lowered them again.

[artax_2]

I looked at the Smoke Stacks, but didn’t want the dual coils. Was worried about overdoing it in terms of changing the way the guitar sounded. I was trying to keep it similar to how it sounded in its stock form. What I was dealing with was a dead oem pickup. I just wanted a simple replacement. Maybe later I’ll be wanting to really change up the sound.

Edited to add - I’d like to hear this guitar you’re describing, or maybe already have if they aren’t new.

[DarrellW]

If you’re not happy with the output it’s because they’re not a high output pickup, if you look at the Pig Iron overwound those are - the way to figure out how hot they are is by the resistance, anything around 6.0 to 6.5 is low to medium output, 7.5+ is high output.
The Pig iron overwound pickups will be significantly better for your wants/needs.

[artax_2]

Good to know! I’ll keep it in mind. The Iron Gear pickups are so reasonably priced, I wouldn’t think twice about purchasing different ones.

[SgtColon]

Michael, I’m not sure how many you wanted but hopefully these will be okay.

Thanks.

[sequences]

perfect, you have a lot of room to work in there - not all crammed together like my SG.

This will let us know what you are starting with and we can look for pitfalls for you to avoid.

Thanks!

[firasR]

Good luck on your pickup upgrade project Stefan I took the cowardly and more expensive route of using an Obsidian Wire harness

I did come across this free course however that might be useful for you to learn how to do it yourself (I had issues signing up, hopefully you’ll have better luck if you decide to check it out):

Seymour Duncan - Pickup Installation 101

[sequences]

Hi Stefan,

See this:

Soldering Tutorial

Soldering Tutorial This is intended for people who want to repair or alter their guitar electronics and have little or no experience in soldering. I have seen a few people updating their guitars recently that have little or no experience with soldering. This will hopefully be a good reference for them. Author’s Background I learned to solder from my father about age 8. He held a job as a quality inspector at one point and had my capability up to military standards by the time I was about a…

Hope it isn’t too over-done!

[SgtColon]

Thanks Firas, I’ll take a look at the Seymour Duncan installation.