While As Tears Go By is well rehearsed I wanted to try one last experiment in OBS setup.
For those not familiar, and maybe it is a South Africanism, ABF is Absolutely Bloody Final. Usually used in the pub, when agreeing to one last drink, before calling it a night. Also referred to as a ‘loop dop’, literally ‘walk drink’. So this is indeed the last time I shall inflict this song upon you, at least without allowing significant water to flow under the proverbial bridge. I promise.
This one involved using a metering application to monitor level of the output from OBS in real time. I also changed the monitor setup in OBS to be able to hear in real time the effects of any filters and level changes.
For extra fun, I first created a backing track with simple power chords in my looper. The looper plugged into AI channel 1. Then all the fiddle and fettle in OBS to get that sounding OK. Then more fiddle and fettle to get the acoustic guitar and vocal sorted. Recorded through the Play Acoustic pedal via AI channel 2.
Cut a long story short, I ended up listening only to the looper in the right ear and moved the left side of the headphone off my ear to hear my guitar and vocal directly. Proved to be the best way to hear the backing and myself with the levels right.
Metering and monitoring served me well and was almost at the desired level in the video upload.
A fun time, lots learned, and I hope you enjoy the end result.
Now on with song practice for OM10 and NYLSB solo practice.
I love the end result. I was gonna say: “You really like this song?” till I realized what you were trying to do. I salute you for the amount of patience you have to do all this stuff. Chapeau! You are starting to become an expert in recording and sound. Great.
Sounding good in the component parts but I would have to agree with Jay there is a little latency going on. Did you use that Banana for feeding the cans ? I still can’t get that to work without a time lag. If the BT and PA are going into the AI, it may be better to monitor with 'phones from the Scarlett (think that’s what you have?). So that way you should hear the wet audio that will be hitting OBS. So never say never. Get them dice tumbling and roll again, as I know you want to get this right. Sorry pal I hate to say this needs a little more tweaking. DM me if you want to follow up offline.
@sandy, Thanks for staying with it, one more time, Sandy. For me it is all fun and just another part of the adventure. Learning, play and sing, and be able to live stream and record…just love it all.
@think2100 Thanks Jay. I listened back with fresh (I was pretty stale at the end and in that 'just want to be done and post mode…no excuse) ears and I agree. I am hearing the acoustic as slightly behind the power chords?
@TheMadman_tobyjenner Thanks Toby. So to continue. I think this is monitor/record latency. I was not using Banana, it was giving me grief. I swapped the Virtual Cable out for the PC audio and monitored with 'phones plugged into the PC socket. It may have been better to use the AI (yes, Scarlet 2i2) for playback and monitor. Perhaps it needed a latency tweak in the OBS Advanced Audio Properties?
The other challenge I had in this was getting the power chord levels to sit OK with the guitar & vocal. Balancing the levels for being playing over the backing and being good for the live recording was unexpectedly tricky.
No apology needed on feeding back that it is ‘close but no cigar’ is fine, that’s why we experiment, post, and hope for feedback.
That said, I am drawing a line under this one now. I did promise it was ABF. It has served it’s purpose. I learned a lot, gained experience, and many positives to takeaway. Not stressed that this is not yet nailed and hit out the ballpark.
Now it is time to work on the setup for OM10. I shan’t inflict the experiments on the Community in AVOYP.
@batwoman Glad to have given you a laugh, laughter is the best medicine, or so they say.
@batwoman Of course, I knew that, Maggie, never thought for a second that you (or anybody) would be so mean-spirited in our Community as to laugh at anybody’s music shared.
Yep, Windows audio has some latency, enough to cause this. Monitoring wet sound through 2i2 with a small (low latency) buffer is probably your best bet.
I think with both BT and the PA inputs both going through the AI, if you monitor on the Scarlett they should be synced and no need to tweak the OBS offset.
My issue when I use the UMC1820, is that the monitoring can be switched from “dry” DI input to “wet” output ie the audio from the PC. When set to 100% PC output I’ll get some latency, so I hear what I have played and sung delayed, which is really off putting. Setting it to half way reduces the latency to a workable level, so its a compromise. And that allows me to use Reaper to improve the mix but I am shying away from that for “live” performance.
So, if I were to use the PA for Vox and the POD for Gtr into the AI and “dry” monitor all would be ok. But if you are putting FX on the OBS channels these will not be heard. And if you are doing that (don’t think you are, so general observation for folk) those FX in OBS will add to the latency, between the DI at the AI and the sound you will hear from the PC.
If I went to the monitor approach and not headphones, I’d use the soundbar connected to both AIs. The Xenyx works well that way but the UMC needs to set to DI/Dry.
As usual we live and learn and hopefully keep taking one step forward ! Fun and games.
@JK, Thanks Jk. Next time I try to make a live recording playing over backing I will try this. I don’t do this very often, maybe I should do so more frequently, learn how to resolve the latency issues and get better playing over a BT, which does highlight poor timing.
@TheMadman_tobyjenner I think you are correct Toby, I’d have done better using a Direct Monitor on the AI. Then I could have tweaked the gain on the AI to be able to hear myself and the backing. In sound checking could have tweaked the incoming levels on the OBS sources to ensure the output was balanced to taste.
For this recording I was adding a few filters in OBS. That no doubt contributed to my offset.
As you say, live and learn.
I had another productive session this morning, working towards the next OM. Shaping up quite nicely. A simpler scenario using just the PA, with the guitar and vox separated output option to be able to push the guitar out left and right. Guitar-vox balance sounding reasonable and hitting YT at -4.8dB.
Have to say I much preferred your previous version David. I skipped to the second half of this video to hear the completed production and your timing seems to be out with your backing track. Whatever you did last time was better.
Hey,
Tones sounded good to me all the way around. What I found strange was what you laid down on the looper. It just sounded a little off to me, like out of tune or something. Yet your vox and more so the finger work on your acoustic fit in well and cemented it all together and gone was the looper sourness. Cool stuff and I am interested in the chords on this. Is there a lot of minor chords in it?
I enjoyed the song but from a personal point of view I think it just sounds better straight up on the acoustic but that could be because I love that acoustic sound.
@sairfingers Thanks Gordon. I did this as an experiment using OBS and a looper exercise, and learned a lot, including the fact that I never managed the latency between the two. Probably wouldn’t ever consider playing this live in this way.
@LBro Thanks LBro. Power chord tones all created in OBS using various vst plugins. The guitar was tuned before but maybe went out before I settled on the version I used in the video. Only one minor chord, Em shape with the capo on the 5th.
@SgtColon Thanks Stefan. Fair enough on the preference. And as I said to Gordon above, it was just an obvious opportunity to try some looper work and play over it, which should be easier than I found it to be.
On guitar tuning - did you check it “after” putting on the capo? Not a big deal and certainly when you played the rest of the parts it fit together well and sounded good. Maybe it was the minor chord…
LB
