Learning whole songs vs practising all the time

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Hiya all

Lately I’ve noticed I can play loads of parts of songs, but I rarely finish learning a whole one. I’ve been deep into technique and theory—working on scales, fingerstyle, triads, and 7th arpeggios (loving “attacking” those 3rds). It’s all been super fun and useful, but I feel like I’m hitting a wall when it comes to actually playing music.

I’ve just started to really enjoy my electric (it feels like a whole different beast compared to my acoustic), and I want to make the most of it. I’ve learned a few solos now and intros to stuff I like but not full songs. I do play 12 bar blues shuffle a lot to warm my fingers up

ATM I can play about 5 whole songs:
Blackbird
Knocking on heavens door (dylan)
Crossroads (minus the solo)
Polly (accoustic)
When I come around

Should I hit pause on the academic side for a bit and just knuckle down on finishing songs? Anyone else been here?

TIA gang

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I was severely lacking in songs I could play through. At the first of the year I decided to make this a year of learning songs. What I am seeing is that I get part way into a song and need to learn a technique or get much better at one. Sounds like that may not be your problem. This is making learning a full song slow, but I am building a better foundation now and that should improve learning new songs down the road.

I can play a lot of riffs, intros, and the like, but in short bursts before a mistake that is fairly large shows up. I find there is a stamina required to play a full song and that can only be practiced by playing full songs. For me it is mental stamina, not wandering off thinking about something I just did or how I could do it differently. This is my benefit of taking this year to work on full songs.

I still need to work on technique and keep those things in my daily. I have not watched a NEW justin lesson since December and I can tell the difference in my ability to apply myself longer to a song and I have improved on several basics that I had not worked long enough on before removing them from my dedicated practice time.

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I have resisted “learning songs” for a long time. Many excuses, but they come down to insecurity, and - to be honest - boredom. (not picking on any genre, but after I’ve played the same chord progression 16 times, I tend to drift off…[sigh])
For those, my answer is to sing! If I had a nickle for every time someone praised my singing, well, I’d be in debt. But it keeps me involved. And it’s FUN.
Also, I do focus on instrumental pieces … but the singing was a revelation!

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My personal guitar history is one of tried and quit, tried and quit etc but this time I’m succeeding and part of that is because I’ve focused on learning songs.

On those failed attempts I learned riffs and fancy bits of songs but ultimately after weeks/months of playing I realised I couldn’t actually play anything and lost interest. A solo or riff is nothing without a song to go round it.

This time around it’s been songs all the way with just a little bit of theory on the side. At first it was very simple songs, but I learned to play them along to the original recording and that was huge for me. As time has gone on, I’ve started to learn more complex songs but the approach has been the same. I’m not learning fancy solos or anything that advanced yet but I’m having FUN and that’s what keeps me playing. To my way of thinking there was little point learning theory when I had no playing skills to practice what I learned. That’s starting to change now but still playing songs is the majority of my playing time

Crucially though, I recognise that my way isn’t the only way. Perhaps you have a different overall goal to me, perhaps playing simplified covers of other people’s music sounds really boring to you, that’s fine, I’m just sharing how it’s gone for me.

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Excellent response Michael. This has been my experience too. I have a bunch of songs I can “kind of play” portions or all of, but not well. Even though it can be a bit tedious working on the same handful of songs day after day, building stamina to play all the way through, fine tuning your technique and adding some embellishments, then playing them comfortably without looking down much - that’s the satisfaction.

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I dont really understand because , if you follow Justin’s lessons , you should have learned songs since grade 1 …
there’s a song to play for each technic you learn

By whole songs , do you mean like the originals ?

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I agree with all of the answers above. I’m a bit sheepish about entering the conversation. I’ve been practicing solidly for several months. I’ve been trying to focus on learning more songs. But if you asked me to “play something” I don’t think I could.

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@AaronAddams if you want to play more songs from start to finish consider getting the app SongBook I have the Pro version i guess Its really cheap and a one time deal. Its really powerful. You can add songs with chords and tabs. Have the muisc play. Make song lists a ton of features. Its real basic to work with as well. And a ton of custimization for everything you see.

It is my go to for playing with full songs. I use other stuff for transcribing and practice. But this I my on the go with all my songs I know and can play. I would give all the expensive stuff up and keep this if I could only have one thing.

Here are some screen shots. You should learn and ultimatly practice these song from start to finish in my opinion. Cause then you are Playing the full song right? Then its a lock.

Good luck.

:victory_hand:t2::love_you_gesture:t2::sign_of_the_horns:t2:

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IMHO learning songs to play off the cuff is not a simple thing to do, it requires repetition, focus, and memory method.

25 years ago I spent nearly 2 years doing a Music BTEC. Every 2 weeks we had to pick 3 new songs/pieces to play and be able to solo on one, the was in a small band scenario. Each band had to perform them live to a public audience. So how did we learn(memorise) the songs, the answer is very few did, most had the basic structure in their heads and nearly all were improving the solo or playing something close to the original, and when we performed we had simple chord/lyric sheets to refer to as prompts,

To learn a simple song structure fully and retain it forever is not a simple thing, especially as you get older. Take ‘Wish You Were Here’ Pink Floyd as an example, it is actually quite a complex piece to learn fully, especially in entirety with solos. I started the process with Justin’s lessons on it in September 24, I had the intro and 1st solo playable after about 2 months of struggle, and the verse/chorus came along in a simple form. Then I wanted to play the rest so set to work on the using an app to play along with. It wasn’t until around March 25 that I felt comfortable playing it without many mistakes, some of the length of time wa due to my playing skills were low initially. I must have played WYWH least once/twice a day for over 3 months. Now to the reality do I know enough to play it from memory with no prompts, NO is the answer. Recently I started BLIM and I not played WYWH for 4 weeks, along with other songs. So I tried to play it, 1st attempt the intro was messy and wrong, it took at 3 more passes making corrections before it was back, the verse/chorus was similar, and I still have to get the solos back in shape.

The point is professional musicians will be playing the same songs hundreds of times, and very regularly, eventually each song becomes second nature to them, as they add new songs they learn them perform them and so the process continues. But even they will rehearse before a tour to refresh old and perfect new material.

I doubt many off us here are even semi-professional musicians, and most that do perform do so at open mics or similar doing 2 or 3 songs, so it an easier task but will take longer to learn new material.

It’s the way it is, I would try not to beat yourself up over it, keep practicing a set small repertoire as Justin advises regularly, and they should become like a pair of comfy slippers you slip into. Also it should become easier and quicker as guitar skills improve, I have noticed I can learn how to play a song much quicker now than last year, but it also depends pick tricky technical one or requiring a new skill and it can take much longer.

Anyway enough rambling from me, that’s my perspective on learning songs,

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I mean, nobody but you can answer that question, really. Do you want to know more songs? Or is that more a feeling of 'I should know more songs because generally people do, and don’t you need them to be a good musician (but I am actually quite content with what I’m doing)? Do you want to play with or for others more? You don’t need songs to have fun with the guitar and be a musician.

I am learning songs because I want to play for/with others, because I like to sing by myself, and I have fun doing them to a backing track. I also use songs to gauge where I am in my guitar journey, or learn new techniques, chords, rhythms, patterns, etc., but that’s just because I get bored trying to learn new stuff without applying it somewhere, and you don’t appear to have that problem. Oh, and of course there is that nice feeling of accomplishment when I can say ‘Oh, hey, I can play that song!’

If you do want to play more songs all the way through, singing or playing with the recording makes it a lot easier; it’s just incredibly boring for me without it. Having fancy stuff in it like cool strumming pattern, funky rhythms, dynamics, bridges, solos, intros, etc. helps, but without something doing the melody, rhythm guitar alone is just, well, boring. And it doesn’t even matter if your singing is good when you start; first, it’ll get better, and second, nobody but you is listening.

I also recommend sitting down and really digging into a song on the whole, maybe even write it by hand into a songbook, with all the words, all the solos and fancy bits, notes on dynamics, etc. if you’re into stuff like that. It helps me really getting to know a song, and when I know and understand something completely, I tend not to forget it as easily.

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Learn and play songs, you will get much out of doing so. One can to easily get caught up in a cycle of constant learning and not making music. which is the reason for picking up an instrument, is it not?
Plus and very important, enjoy yourself and have fun playing.

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Yes, I generally agree, but also investigating and experimenting and composing your own songs, chords and melodies, experimenting with chord progressions can be very rewarding and help learning music theory. I think that is partly the reason a lot of musicians end up creating there own material, apart from hoping to get a break and become famous.

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Thanks for your response, I do think its time I sat down and nailed some full songs beginning to end, I like your idea of taking a large portion of time to do just that

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Plating covers sounds perfect for me, thank you for sharing your experience.

I do very much wish I could/would sing

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Memorising songs isn’t the issue its actually playing them all the way through.

I love wish you were here and going to get starrted on it today :smiley:
ADHD is my real issue as I learn some of a song and then move onto something else before I’ve finished it.

I practise every day but usually just end up noodling and playing scales etc and the intros to a bunch of simple stuff

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I really appreciate that thanks.

I’m a bit lazy when it comes to playing along with recordings so will give it a shot for sure.
I actually want to play live and hopefully join/form a band but there is very little in the way of live music these days where I live.

your words of encouragement and the others here have really helped.

it took me months to be able to play blackbird but that was a skill thing as I only started fingerstyle this year

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Awesome, I’ll check it out for sure :smiley:

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Remember that you can layer up songs. If it’s Wish You Were Here, then start simple. Make sure you can play a very simplified version all the way through. Once you can do that, then maybe pick a part to “level up” and try that. It doesn’t need to be in at the deep end on day 1 and equally learning a simplified version isn’t a waste of time

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Yes it is very easy to wander of on a different path, I am guilty too, I should be practicing for BLIM now for example. You need to develop some OCD traits, coming I am known for until total frustration sets in on what I am trying to perfect.

What might help, if you are not doing so already is to create a detailed practice routine in JG, with each song, scale, arpeggios, licks rhythms etc you are currently working on.

Decide a time limit for each, 5, 10 or 15 minute chunks, then each day start the routine and for each set the timer when you start, and stick to it, do not move onto the next without finishing what you are practicing currently. For example if you are working on playing all the way through WYWH keep doing so until the timer stops you when the alarm rings. If you do not finish the practice routine one day then pick up where you left off until finished, and then restart the whole routine. Obviously you can add to and remove practice items as you progress and are happy with them, or shorten time spent on songs, so if you play one well it just a run through to keep it fresh

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imho, learning a whole song is practicing all the time.
I mostly try to play songs. All the way through.
This has required me to practice one song over, over, and over (practicing). I’d guess to learn a song, for me, requires me to play it 50-100 times. There’s always a hitch somewhere that I must overcome. Since I play by myself, I also have to overcome it’s just me, not a band. I have to figure a way to put a song together that may have momentary lead parts together with the rhythm parts. Some times this can take a while to accomplish too (again, practicing). My goal when I play a whole song is not to be accurate to it’s original version. It’s to have the song sound like me, doing a rendition of a song.

Also, since I’m not a pro musician, I don’t need to memorize a song. I can always use music, props to play the song. I don’t feel bad about that since I’m not playing for anyone but me, usually.

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