A separate thread set my mind thinking on this topic. Iād previously put something together on the composition of a rock band for a work video (the purpose was to show people how to produce short educational videos rather than to educate on rock bands ). I listed the future video production plan without any intention of producing them. The āfuture videoā plan is where this post is going (but without the vids ). Iām talking about rock, pop bands etc. rather than big bands or orchestras or similar.
Iāve played (and still do) keys, bass and guitar in bands. And Iāve a drummer in my family (one of my sons).
These are my thoughts, possibly somewhat simplistic and Iām not claiming they are definitive . Hopefully others find it an interesting topic.
Drummer - tempo and groove
Bass - groove (I think groove is a better description of the drum / bass partnership rather than ārhythm sectionā) and outlining the harmony
Keys - can be outlining harmony; can be melody; can be pads that help to give a sound layer over which other band members play; can be playing fiddly / twiddly bits to give interest to the songs. You donāt want them doing all of them at the same time thoughš.
Guitars - rhythm, lead (might or might not be melody), picking notes e.g arpeggiating chords (could clash or complement with the keys fiddly bits, or the outlining of harmony).
Singer - well sing. But it could be lead, or harmony, or other backing vocals. The singer might be a vocalist who only sings, or vocals can be provided by one or more of the instrumentalists in the band.
Other instruments (horns etc) - these are a bit out of my wheelhouse, but Iād love to hear what others think.
So what do you think? Iād love to hear your thoughts.
I like your description of the bass/drums relationship as setting the groove.
Canāt add much more, but Iāve got a bit of trumpet in the past so I have a bit of an interest in horns in bands. I suppose it depends on the kind of horns youāre talking about and the style of music, but it seems like in a typical rock band context, horns tend to be used more for color and accents.
Sax kinda overlaps a bit with the function of a guitar, particularly lead guitar. when I hear a band with a sax, there is often a back-and-forth between the sax and lead guitar. sometimes the sax replaces lead guitar.
in ska, the horns are quite a bit more prominent and they do seem to take the lead spot (with the guitars staying more in the rhythm side).
no discussion of orchestral instruments in a rock band would be complete without mentioning Ian Andersonās flute use. Which he does use for lead lines and also fiddly/twiddly bits as you describe).
Iām in a gigging covers band. When I say gigging, I mean pubs, clubs, and the occasional function. Weāre not trying to make a living out of it, but in the context of roles hereās why I mention it:
Drummer: metronome - brakeman to stop the rest of us (me especially) from getting too excited when the adrenaline of a performance kicks in.
Bass: no.2 metronome and the person I rely on most for knowing where I am in a song.
Rhythm guitar & lead vocals - which happens to be me. Front man, entertainer, crowd (I wish) command. Also solid rhythm playing but choosing guitar tones that donāt squash the bass or lead guitar.
Lead guitar: front man no.2 who makes the spine tingle and the girls swoon (Joking of course). Six string lead singer - ie helping to make the songs sound authentic.
Keyboards: Musical director, listener and critic in chief. Primary role to tell the lead guitarist when heās too loud. We would be absolutely and completely lost without him. He is the closest thing to an orchestral conductor we have.
We are all committed to practice, we rehearse weekly, we never fallout with each other, and we just aim to have a blast when we gig. There are screw ups but we carry each other and donāt take ourselves too seriously.
From what Iāve read, thatās why Cream didnāt last. Ginger Baker couldnāt stand Jack Bruce because he would run the volume way up on his bass and completely step on the drums.
Musical role - the playing bit at a gig.
Creative role - songwriting if itās original songs, arranging if itās cover songs.
Leadership role - who organizes rehearsals and provides encouragement to others.
Managerial role - who books the venue and publicizes the gig.
Logistical role - the roadie, the guy who owns a van.
The original post was I think about the music. There are 2 components in music, rhythm and melody. Nearly all the instruments will be playing the rhythm part most of the time. The singer is singing the melody. Sometimes an instrument will play a solo part which could also be considered a melody.
Harmony comes from 2 or more instruments playing simultaneously. You would hope the band is in harmony. Sometimes they will be playing the same note. Sometimes they will be playing the same note but at a different pitch. Sometimes they will be playing different notes but usually in the same key.
I just participated in a full band jam for the first time a couple weeks ago after attending a two day Blues Jam Survival Workshop. To say I was nervous is an understatement and I opted out on the option to do a lead.
Anyway, I 100% agree with your point about the bass player. As I was participating, doing just the rhythm piece, I found myself focusing on the bass player to ensure I was playing in time with an occasional glance to the drummer and lead guitarist/instructor who was the band leader. The occasional glance was more to make sure I was still in sync with the rest of the band and the all important piece of everyone ending the song at the same time.
Oh, and some have mentioned flute, horns, etc. Letās not forget about harmonica which can serve a whole host of roles, from fills, to call and response with a guitar player to full on leads, etc.
For me it is always the snare drum (2 & 4) that provides rhythmic orientation. Occasionally, there is a bass line, drum fill or a vocal line that gives que when you need to come in with your guitar part - either lead or rhythm.
I canāt agree more. Getting the proper balance of instruments (tones, frequencies, levels) and vocals should be the main objective. However, this is not easy even without human factor to āturn it to 11ā. There are objective issues with monitoring, different gear (cabs, PA, mixers) different mix tasteā¦ It takes time and a lot of trials and errors to learn these things.
I, for one, am not going to work well with someone who approaches a band with this kind of controlling ādo what youāre supposed to do and stfuā attitude.
Hmmmmā¦itās not as rigid as that. Plenty of actors ad lib parts that wind up being key to the movie/show. Plenty of directors take the input of actors and change things during filming. Itās not a rigid top-down structure - itās more collaborative. And if you pay attention, a lot of actors really donāt like directors who run a rigid top-down operation.
Thereās a level of ādo what youāre supposed to doā that that needs to happen, but itās also music, and that music needs to make room for flexibility. If youāve got a drummer or a bass player who likes to be featured, youāre headed for some serious discord in your band if you donāt make space for that in your music. Everybody in the band needs to feel fulfilled by their roles within that band.
Am in NYC on business and on a whim asked at the box office I was walking past if the nights sold out Tedeschi Trucks show had a loose ticket. They did. I bought it and ā relevant to this string ā I not only got a terrific show that significantly exceeded the blues genre I expected (not my fav) but a phenomenal example of a huge array of varying band roles. The band was huge. Trucks on lead guitar. Tedeschi on lead vocals, rhythm and lead guitar. Two male and one female backup singers. Three horns. Sax, trombone and trumpet. Keyboard player. Bass. Two drummers each with full kit side by side. Two of the back up singers were giving full song solos front stage. Keyboardist also sang. One of the horn players too. Virtually every musician including tge two drummers (in ensemble) were given lengthy solos. All during this the two leads ā including Trucks whose playing put meaning to the word virtuoso) patiently stood aside and let all these band mates have extensive leads, sometimes multiple times. But neither Trucks nor Tesdeschi shorted tge audience in the slightest. The show started at 7:30 and ended just shy of midnight. Trucks slide work was amazing but his beautiful legato work and a unique atonal number was a huge surprise.
No one said that they shouldnāt be featured - they should indeed!
The example was that band members donāt follow what and how the song was rehersed, just to individualy feature themselves - they compete within the band. I think that everything should be rehearsed and agreed, so the whole band understands what is happening when - including improvisations. What will happen during that improvisation can be the moment of inspiration for the band member.
What definitely doesnāt work is having individual players featuring themselves (volume up, taking solos when no one expects, etc) as they wish, just because they feel like it - that is completely undesirable behaviour in any team.
Iāve really come to appreciate jazz and love watching the way band members work together. Itās such a collaborative arrangement - all it takes is a small nod and everyone seems to know who will be improvising next. The others take a back seat and work to fit in with whatever that person is playing.
Good stuff on the horns Nate. I did a jam night set with a band who usually had a sax player, but who wasnāt going to play that night. I suggested some songs from the bandās set list. There were a couple of them they didnāt want to do because the sax player wouldnāt be there. I think that was probably because they were using the sax as the lead instrument in those songs rather than guitars.
āFront manā - thatās a role I missed Martin. An important one though. āā¦aim to have a blast when we gigā - thatās also very important.
Yes it was Chris. But I like that you expanded it to other roles. To your point on harmony:
I used harmony to mean 2 different things without realising. Regarding the instruments I was meaning how the chords move and the quality of the chords (major, minorā¦). For the singers āharmonisingā (e.g. singin a 3rd above the melody) might have been a better word choice.
Focussing on the bass player is interesting Joe (and good to hearš). I bet most students focus on the instructor, just because he is the instructor.
Do you think an understanding of the roles in the band helps with this Boris, or is it always the same whenever a new band gets together?
I like Jazz too. I usually get to Ronnie Scottās a couple of times a year with my drummer son. Some Jazz is more of an improvised art form than pop or rock music though, so the thought process in the bands with respect to roles may well be different.
I agree with that, but the post I quoted came out pretty aggro about it. Iāve had serious conflicts with people who demanded top-down control in other situations where such a strict top-down control mindset is more damaging than helpful. I put my foot down on that stuff hard when I can.
IMO, a band should be collaborative. Yes, the band should agree on how to do things and stick to the plan, but a band is a collective, not a dictatorship.
I think part of my reason following the bass player was to ensure I was hitting my chord changes at the right time (i.e. not changing after three bars when I should be changing after four, etc.). It helped keep in time and changing chords at the right time. Iām sure some of it has do do with my inexperience but it worked.
I think it helps, but it is much more than just that. Professional bands will have technicians who would help them achieve that balance, both in studio or live.
). I listed the future video production plan without any intention of producing them. The āfuture videoā plan is where this post is going (but without the vids 
). Iām talking about rock, pop bands etc. rather than big bands or orchestras or similar.