Thanks Toby. Appreciate the thoughtful feedback and suggestions. I will give those a try.
I like the idea about sentences and inflections. Down the line the time will come to study more solos and learn from the greats.
But not just yet.
1 Like
And another few weeks go by, quick as a flash. Havenāt put in as much time as I should be doing to really progress this. A combination of work and other guitar activities, including the increased focus on learning from soloāing over the Layla intro/chorus progression.
Looking at the video, I see hand rotation plus still more hand/arm pulling up action than Iād like to see. I think tone wise when I listen to a bend I can hear if it is flat and raise more until it sounds like the note, which may still be a little flat or sharp according to the pitch meter. It is interesting, it seems to suddenly going from sounding flat to sounding right. But overall that bending to pitch seems to be getting a little better. And then try some of the licks and it all falls apart 
Vibrato seems to be getting better and helpful to practice vibrato on the note being played with the ring finger.
No matter, itās a long haul and thereās no time clock on this. Iām still enjoying and thatās what matters most. I think next time I must pay attention to my wrist, try and keep it more locked to support the pivoting/rotation action for both vibrato and bending.
Have also become a little more focused on connecting minor pentatonic patterns horizontally. The Layla noodles provide an opportunity to start in position 4 and then traverse up through 5 and 1 to reach 2.
1 Like
Good to see you keeping at it David, I admire your persistance and I think while playing to backing tracks and trying to incorporate vibrato or bends will pay you dividends on top of having a few mins a day to just practice what you have been doing on this video.
1 Like
David
Your self critiques is spot on, so you know what you need to work on. But I would suggest focusing on keeping your wrist straight on both ring finger vibrato and the bend. What I said before holds true, the action on your index finger vibrato is the perfect bend execution (in my limited knowledge). When you do that @10 secs, see what your ring finger is doing BUT watch how straight your wrist stays. It does not arch at all. Look at the 3rd finger vibrato at 19 secs, see how the base of your palm moves upwards, not just the right side. Iāve tried to replicate the action and its like you are pulling your wrist and lower forearm towards your chest, rather than rotate it anti clockwise - as per your index finger vibrato.
@1:40 watch not only the wrist arching but the head moving backward, then compare the vibrato with the index finger that follows - the head does not move back at all.
Hope these observations help. Took me ages to get a half decent action and still not convinced its right even now!
Cheers
Toby
2 Likes
@adi_mrok
Thanks Adrian. Yeah, persistence is the only way Iāve got anywhere with guitar, nothing comes too ānaturallyā to me. Now if only the stars aligned and I got myself self-disciplined so that if nothing else I actually did spend the 10 minutes every day in this little routine.
@TheMadman_tobyjenner
Thanks for taking the time to study the routine, analyse and share the feedback, Toby. It is good to get the confirmation and guidance. Iād never noticed the wrist before, and sorting that out should be another step. I always celebrate the gain while looking at the gap. So happy that I am no longer pulling it up from the shoulder. I shall keep at it and am not at all stressed how long it may take to get an effective bending and vibrato technique down.
2 Likes
Well, I keep practising my bending. The practise has been worth while as I saw early reward in being able to play an improv that included some bending. How accurate were those bends ā¦ well nobody gave me feedback that they were terribly flat (more likely than sharp, I guess). I hope that somebody would have pointed that out if it were the case.
My practise continues to be up and down in terms of frequency of sessions per week, very much dependent on my energy levels and the work day. And of late if we have electricity in the time slot when Iād pick up the electric. Sadly in South Africa we have āthird worldā problems with electricy supply and so power is cut to reduce consumption periodically, our so-called āload-sheddingā.
That aside, today I have power, both electricity and my own, so a good day to practice and record. I am pleased with this session.
Firstly, I noticed that thumb position is important. My natural tendency is to bring the thumb a little too far forward. When I shift it back to be more in line with where the index finger meets the bottom of the neck a more solid pivot point is created. OK, I know DUH that is what Justin taught me ā¦ but being taught and applying every fine detail. Well for me, thatās two different things. Anyhow, I noticed and it seems to help.
Secondly, I notice that the start position of the hand makes a difference, the angle between the bottom of the neck and the outside edge of the hand. A bigger angle leads to the fingers being in a less curled position on the string and produces more rotation and bend. This is tricky as my natural playing position is with the outside edge closer to parallel with the neck.
Anyhow, I think there were some moments of good technique, and reasonable pitch in this practice record, amongst the chaff.
1 Like
@DavidP do yourself a favor and learn Wonderful Tonight.
Richard always say learn songs, this also applies to learning
bends. Using bends musically will teach you more than just
trying to do bends. Use your ears to get the bends in the riff
to pitch. Wonderful Tonight will also help you with phasing
in your playing and timing.
Learn the riff note for note, bend by bend.
1 Like
Thanks Rick. Same approach as using the licks from Layla intro solo. It makes sense to do that.
David
Definitely some improvements, the pull up is not so pronounced. The odd sharp overbend but pitch wise certainly more consistent. What you said about finger angle, is true and a hard habit to break, after all the time we spend learning scales with arched tippy toe finger tips all horizontal to the neck. Then we get to impro/lead and find we really should be 30-45 degree to the fretboard and our fingers need to be much flatter. That will help a lot and the straighter the fingers the make it easier to bend, with the rotational movement. I have found doing chromatic four fret exercises vertically in one position helps, just focusing on the finger angle and them being flatter but still find that arch creeping back. What I think would help your bend a little more is getting your thumb over and then squeezing, just an idea.
Keep working at it David you are making progress. I have had pretty much a guitar free week with negative mojo, came back to my 30 Licks this afternoon and my bends sucked. Took an hour or so to get some semblance of order but still lacking in my view, so its something that needs constant attention but you have the rest of the weekend. Just whack on one of the 15 minute backing tracks and loop it. Just spend a few hours bending and noodling with some reference point. Make it fun.
Cheers
Toby
Thanks Toby. Iāll give that a try, next time out. Just put the guitar down. Iāve been working in G since one can run from G root on low E all the way up to a final G on the 15th high e. Lots of fun and working towards some improv in G, which aligns with Rickās Wonderful Tonight suggestion. Though the tone I dialed in would be more suitable for a Metallica cover than ECās 
There sure is something primal just hitting open D and G and let them ring 
Not quite the same way David. Iād like to see you learn Wonderful Tonight note for note, Not just half ass and move on. Everything youāve been trying to do for the last 18 weeks is in the short riff. Justin stresses how important learning by listening is and how importamt transcribing is. You can learn way more from listening and learning how other people play. Once you can do that then you can work on your own style.
1 Like
Hi David,
What a story man with that eletricity,ā¦you have made a huge jump with your bending arm/shoulder movement,ā¦that must be zero (keep elbow still and shoulder), but you were aware of that before,ā¦but now I feel a little less vicarious pressure on my arm and shoulder muscles, later in the video there seemed to be more movement againā¦so that seems to me it is important to work well on it,ā¦that will make the differenceā¦good luck and have fun practicing.
Greetings
Hi David,
If you donāt mind a bit of, hopefully, constructive criticism, I noticed that on your 1st finger vibrato, youāre getting a lot of wrist rotation, but the pivot point is actually the tip of your finger, so itās not moving much and hence a very narrow vibrato. The pivot point should be further up the finger, so your finger tip (and the string) is moving back and forth. Itās a bit hard to describe, but you can see it clearly in: Blues Vibrato | JustinGuitar.com, at around the 10:40 mark.
cheers.
Good on you to keep at it, David. Iām a beginner at this too so my only comment is that I liked when you were using the Smoke on the Water riff to practice bends. That makes it much more musical, and then itās easier to hear whether the bends fit or not. Rickās comment about working out Wonderful tonight make sense to me in that context.
I agree with Stitch here, learning some songs incorporating bends throughout will help massively and will make things more interesting for sure 
I could hear improvement since last update and I feel learning Wonderful tonight will step up your game massively.
Something along Mariās Parisienne Walkways update thread would be great!
1 Like
Hope you donāt mind me chiming in here.
Certainly not here to give advice, and Iām fairly new to bending as you probably know, but I ditched the formal exercises after a couple of weeks, after getting the basic mechanics down somewhat.
Started applying them to musical contexts - riffs, short solos etc, as it gave me some contextual targets. I think itās helping by putting the pressure on - keeping the rhythm, concentrating on the music, while getting the bends sounding OK - and itās becoming more of a āfeelā thing, rather than a mechanical one.
I imagine the brainās in the background somewhere, subliminally saying " I need that pitch, for that duration, and in time. Just do it". Iām glad itās the right brain in more control here, as I think the left side would just get in the way and mess things up for me.
Bit of a fluffy explanation I know, but the best way I can explain my experience with it so far.
Cheers,
Shane
Goodness me, so many more folk taking time to watch the video analytical and offer encouragement and feedback. I REALLY appreciate it.
@roger_holland it has been a process to from day one to now to work on good technique. I am happy with the progress and will continue to focus on that rotation around the pivot point of base of index finger on the neck. I think when that technique is a little better then it will be easier to bend and focus more on pitch with the mechanics becoming more autopilot.
@jjw I donāt mind at all, I welcome it! Your description is perfect, makes the point crystal clear and donāt need to even look at the video for it to make sense. Iāll give that attention.
@Mari63 I guess if nothing else I am dogged in pursuit of proficiency, and not put off by my tortoise pace of progress. I forgot about SOTW yesterday, was thinking about Justinās āmatch the pitchā drill. I will start working at the intro solo of WT. Not sure if I will attempt transcription. I am anxious when I think of that. I buy the the fact that all the masters learned by transcription and that learning from YT is not the optimal way of developing ear and feel. Iāll see.
@adi_mrok I appreciate the acknowledgement of progress. I feel confident enough to try the WT intro now, so letās see how that goes.
@sclay Absolutely not, all observations and feedback are gratefully received. Personally I feel I still have work to do on the basic mechanics, maybe I am at the āgood enoughā point but Iād like it to be a little more consistently closer to ideal yet. Your explanation makes sense, and Iād like to think to some degree that came through in my last Layla BT improv when I played a short portion with some bends. Next would be a single bend in a lick. And the suggestion made with emphasis here to work on the WT solo builds on your suggestion.
Thanks again for the support and suggestions. I shall keep on keeping on, and sure that it will continue to improve.
1 Like
Thatās the risk of being so nice all the timeā¦
And ssst,Thanks for correcting that " typo" by Gary Mā¦ ā¦ 
And I looked at myself for a while how it would be easier to get your upper arm and shoulder still, ā¦ maybe you can make the movement with your wrist while looking at your elbow and let it hang tight in the right place where it hangs before you start the movementā¦I just tested it on my wife, and it worked for hereā¦
Greetings
1 Like
Well done David. Improvement every time. Sounds as if Layla will be going to a Wonderful Tonight party soon! 
How about bringing it down to the basics and just looking for the first note and bend, rather than thinking of transcribing as writing out some long and complicated tab? Thereās enough in life to be stressed or anxious about, donāt need to have guitar making us anxious
3 Likes