Well done Michael. Onwards and upwards. Have you started the ear training?
James
Just started it and at the point where you have to play the melody for happy birthday, that’s going to be a challenge.
Have got the app but not really tried it yet wanted to get the Theory Grade 2 test done first.
Michael
Maybe this will help. You only need to know the notes on the first 4 at the fifth fret they are the some as the next string open. Adjust for the B string. E string 5th fret is A so the next 4 note on the E string are the same as the A string. the 10 fret on the E string is D so the next 4 notes are the same as the D string. as long ad you adjust for the B string this woeks on all the other strings.
The some goes for the 7th fret but the other way.
Rick
Thanks for this an excellent diagram, however it is the one thing I do know as it is how I tuned my guitar 50 years ago, the so called fifth fret method. In fact I am preparing a just chatting post on this for later issue this weekend.
I had been giving it some thought and thinking if I could remember the shape of notes A, B etc in the five frets then I hopefully my brain can easily fill the gaps in between.
Just downloaded ebooks for Grade 3 and Justin wants you to learn where the ‘major notes’ are and it sounds like what I had in mind.
Cheers Michael
Here’s my issue. I’m just learning to play guitar at 68 and I know “it is what it is” but the TAB goes from thinest 1 string on top to thickest 6 string on the bottom which seems the opposite of what it should be to me. Question 21 asks for the chord box shorthand but starts from thickest string to thinest. Seems ass backward to me. Makes it confusing for a begginer. I’m sure there is logic to it but I don’t get it.
Michael,
I learned the fifth fret tuning method also about 45 years ago in a Mel Bay method book 1, (which I never finished).
I realized last year that this is the key to notes on the fifth fret and above.
Starting at the fifth fret, play the notes on the 6th string as if you are playing on the 5th string, except that you have to fret the notes that correspond to the open string notes. Then the notes on the 6th, 7th and 8th string of the lowest or 6th string are the same as the first position 5th string.
I used to be intimidated by the 5th fret position and the A minor pentatonic scale was just a lot of notes that I played. Then when I thought about it in this way I was able to call out the notes. You just have to shift the notes on the third string down a semi-tone in your head and the second string at the fifth position corresponds to the first string at the first position and the notes on the first string fifth position are the same as the 6th string. I’ve never seen this mentioned in any book so I thought that it would be good to bring it up here.
I don’t know if I have the authority to start a new topic at this point, but this might make an interesting topic of leveraging knowledge of the open string notes and the notes in the first position to knowledge of the entire fretboard. I haven’t mastered it yet but the concept is easy to understand and I’ve never seen it mentioned in any of the dozens of beginner to intermediate guitar methods that I have seen.
Here is an easy example that can help later with 6th and 5th string power chord positions.
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Place your index finger on or behind the nut of the 5th string and play the note of A
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Play the notes in the 1st, 2nd and 3rd frets (A#/Bb, B, C) with the middle, ring and pinkie
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Repeat for the 4th string (index finger on nut and play D, and then D#/Eb, E and F with other three fingers.
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Move index finger to the 6th string and 5th fret and play the 1 finger per fret exercise
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You will be playing A, A#/Bb, B, C, the same notes as in 2 above
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Move index finger to the 5th string 5th fret and play the 1 finger per fret exercise
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You will be playing D, D#/Eb, E and F as in 3 above.
See how easy it is to transfer 1st position fret knowledge to the 5th fret.
I always thought the 5th fret notes were way beyond me until recently.
You can expand this to the 3rd, 2nd and 1st strings at the first position (first 3 frets in this case), but you have to start the index finger on the 1st fret of the 2nd string (note of C) for it to work at the fifth fret. Remember when you get to the first string at the 5th fret the notes repeat (A, A#/Bb, B, C).
You can look at @stitch ’s fretboard figure above and see how this early tuning method would suggest this method of thinking about the fretboard.
I just wanted to add this one last diagram or figure to make what I just said relevant and complementary to the Music Theory Grade 2 lesson of learning the first position notes (CORRECTION: I recently learned that the scale is actually an open position scale since there are open string notes in the scale, I am adding this because I don’t feel like editing and reloading the diagram) and the Grade 2 lesson on playing the A minor pentatonic scale:
Play with the index finger on or behind the nut in the open position A minor pattern except for string 2, where your index finger shifts up to the first fret to play C. When you play the left fretboard diagram you are playing an A minor pentatonic scale, but since you have learned the notes for this position it should be relatively easy to name the notes as you pick the notes.
Then when you shift your hand to the 5th fret and play the A minor pentatonic scale (the yellow arrow on the left side is a mental reminder that the C shifts down a semi-tone to be lined up with the other notes in the fifth fret, the D shifts down too, of course), every finger is playing the exact same notes as in the first position, which should make it easier to call out the notes if you remember what you did in the first position. I just made this figure today in PowerPoint, so hopefully I’ve spotted all the errors
Hello @sticktothemuse and welcome to the community.
Were you to take a print out of TAB and place it flat on a desk, then place your guitar flat on the desk in the manner you play it, with you sitting at the desk, both would have the low E / thickest / 6th string nearest to you. The orientation of the TAB will not always be flat depending on whether you read it on a computer screen, a music stand or other. But the same principle applies regardless of the orientation.
I hope that helps.
Cheers
| Richard_close2u | JustinGuitar Official Guide, Approved Teacher & Moderator
@SteveL_G99
There is logic and correctness in what you describe, and if it has worked for you then your valuable effort in explaining and offering up these tips may help someone else. Thanks for that.
Justin has lessons on learning the note names - Theory Module 4.3.
Cheers
| Richard_close2u | JustinGuitar Official Guide, Approved Teacher & Moderator
Richard,
Thanks. I appreciate your supportive comments.
I’ve been staring at my diagram and noticed that if you repeat this process from the 5th fret to the 10 fret starting at D on the 6th string 10th fret, the 3 fretted notes on the 7th fret of the A minor pentatonic scale become the 6,5,4 string octave notes at the 12th fret.
So recognizing the notes of the 5th position A minor pentatonic is even easier than I thought. If you have already memorized the 5th string notes, then the 6th and 1st string intervals are A to C (think AC/AC), the 7th string notes are just the AED lowest open string notes and for the second string interval I think EG as in egg).
I had purchased the Practical Music Theory ebook back when I was going through the classic beginners course and saw in my printout that Justin discussed learning the notes on the fretboard very early in the ebook (page 9) using octaves. I look forward to completing this theory course and the intermediate lessons and finally be able to find my way around the guitar fretboard and play above the open position. Right now I am slowly working through the new beginners modules to improve my consolidation efforts.
Richard, thanks for the info. Sorry for the late response.
Just done the Grade 2 test and got 95% so happy with that. Know where I went wrong!! Now to but Grade 3.
100%! Thanks Justin! I’m really loving the course so far. Keep up the great work!
wording issue on question 12……the open strings are also black circles. empty black circles, but black circles nonetheless.
They would be distinguished from the shaded circles by referring to them as hollow or unshaded. The ink colour that creates the circumference just happens to be black.
This must be a UK English vs the rest of the English speaking world thing. The Definition of a circle is
a round plane figure whose boundary (the circumference) consists of points equidistant from a fixed point (the center).
“draw a circle with a compass”
So in Canada the answer to that question would be The Open Strings.
The black filled circles are Dots. the Definition of a dot is
a small round mark or spot.
“a symbol depicted in colored dots”
So the question is either wrong or the answer is wrong. the only circles in the diagram are representing the Open Strings.
I think a better question would be
What do the Black Dots on the Chord Box Diagram represent.
Okay, okay … I have no strong opinion either way and have changed the wording of the question to:
What do the shaded black dots on a chord box diagram represent?
I know what a circle is, whether a mathematical or linguistic definition. I could have also included closed or open circles (such as seen on inequality lines).